The Good Listening To Show: Stories of Distinction & Genius

Founder Story: The Art of Creating Space for Authentic Communication, Collaboration & Growth with Executive Coach & Trainer Ben Nathan, Founder of Luft Coaching

• Chris Grimes - Facilitator. Coach. Motivational Comedian

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Creating space for authentic communication is Ben Nathan's superpower. From his early days as an Actor to his current role as Founder of Luft Coaching, Ben has dedicated himself to helping others find clarity, confidence, and purpose in how they express themselves.

Ben's journey is deeply personal. Growing up as the only Jewish child in his Primary School gave him a unique perspective on identity and belonging – experiencing what it means to feel different in ways others couldn't immediately see. This understanding fuels his approach to diversity and inclusion, bringing genuine empathy to his coaching practice. When he shares the story of his company name – Luft, meaning "space" or "air" in German – we understand it's more than clever branding; it's a reflection of his life philosophy.

The conversation takes us through pivotal moments that shaped Ben's worldview, from the profound influence of his Russian-Jewish grandparents to the devastating loss of his brother to suicide. Rather than allowing tragedy to defeat him, Ben discovered that "out of hardship, good things can come" – a perspective that transformed his relationships with his brother's children and informs how he helps clients navigate their own challenges.

What sets Ben apart is his commitment to "meeting people where they're at." Whether working with corporate teams or guiding his own children, he begins by accepting people as they are, not where he wishes they would be. This philosophy creates the psychological safety essential for genuine growth. Drawing from his teaching background, Ben ensures everyone feels included by incorporating diverse learning styles into his workshops, making them accessible to visual, auditory, reading/writing, and kinesthetic learners.

Ben closes with a powerful metaphor about elephants who remain tethered to small posts because they've been conditioned from infancy to believe they cannot break free. It perfectly encapsulates his mission: helping people recognize and break through self-imposed limitations to discover their true potential.

Ready to find your voice and communicate with greater impact? Connect with Ben Nathan on LinkedIn or visit luftcoaching.com to discover how creating space for authentic communication can transform your personal and professional life.

Tune in next week for more stories of 'Distinction & Genius' from The Good Listening To Show 'Clearing'. If you would like to be my Guest too then you can find out HOW via the different 'series strands' at 'The Good Listening To Show' website.

Don't forget to SUBSCRIBE & REVIEW wherever you get your Podcasts :)

Thanks for listening!

Speaker 1:

Welcome to another episode of the Good Listening To Show your life and times with me, chris Grimes, the storytelling show that features the Clearing, where all good questions come to get asked and all good stories come to be told, and where all my guests have two things in common they're all creative individuals and all with an interesting story to tell. There are some lovely storytelling metaphors a clearing, a tree, a juicy storytelling exercise called five, four, three, two, one, some alchemy, some gold, a cheeky bit of shakespeare and a cake. So it's all to play for. So, yes, welcome to the Good Listening To Show your life and times with me, chris Grimes, are you sitting comfortably? Then we shall begin and get in, is the expression I often use. Welcome to another very exciting founder story episode of the Good Listening To Show Stories of Distinction and Genius. I'm Chris Grimes, but more importantly, this is ben nathan. But before I talk about ben, I'll talk about myself first. So I'm a motivational comedian easy for me to say a facilitator and coach, and this is a podcast on the radio show where I invite movers, makers, shakers, mavericks, influencers and also personal heroes into a clearing or serious happy place of my guests, choosing as we all get on the open road of sharing where your clearing is and will blow as much happy smoke at you as I possibly can.

Speaker 1:

Ben Nathan is a warm, enigmatic presence. You'll experience that very, very soon. We have history in that we live in Bristol. We've known of each other for quite some time. We were at another fellow actor called Saikat Ahmed's show recently where we reconnected, and then I just asked you the question how do you fancy coming in and doing a founder story? So we're going to get into the who, the what, the where, the why, the how, the who, the he, the how, the he of what you do, and we'll get on to, at the very end, doing an exciting bit called show us your QR code, please, where we're going to point everyone to Luft Luft coaching. So, ben Nathan, welcome to the show. Thank you for having me, chris, it's lovely to see you. Yeah, same. So how's morale and what's your story of the day, please?

Speaker 2:

Gosh, morale is good. Morale is good. As long as I've been able to look after my body and my mind, which I have already this morning, then I'm good to go. So, and that might involve a swim, a sauna, some cold water.

Speaker 1:

So there's very definitely a sort of through line already of the holistic approach to what you do and put your own mask on first, there's self care before you can then begin to care for others, as you so brilliantly do.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, absolutely Showing up, you know, and how we all show up, is something that I'm interested in personally and for other people and I think, coming from a performance background, that's kind of ingrained in me anyway, and so sharing those experiences and learning and strategies I think helps others.

Speaker 1:

And we share that resonance as well in that we use the transferable skills of having actor trained to then bring that to bear in the corporate training, the coaching space as well. You're an executive coach, a trainer and a speaker. If you get that really clunky networking question that we've all got to deal with it. But if someone doesn't have a frame of reference for the wonderful warm presence that you are, and you are somebody who's quite enigmatic and people will lean in. But what's your favourite way of answering or avoiding the question, hello, what do you do? So how would you describe what Ben Nathan does?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, and I have various forms of it that aren't necessarily scripted, but essentially it's about helping individuals and teams and organizations to communicate their message with more clarity, have more impact in those important sort of interactions and settings whether that's presentations or networking events, whatever it might be and then, I think, also making better choices individually and in a group setting to have more success.

Speaker 1:

Yes, and it's about curating well a new perspective. So just tell us the story behind the story of why Luft Coaching.

Speaker 2:

Luft is my company. I'm the founder. It's actually a German word which means like space or air and, not to preempt you too much, a clearing, and I think that's what I am passionate about is creating a space where people can talk about difficult subjects, work out what they're going to do next, and you know that's what I love doing is facilitating those kind of spaces. So Luft felt like a good word that encapsulated that and we'll probably come onto it later again. But I subconsciously, deliberately, chose a non-English word because I don't feel 100% British. So in terms of sort of making a nod to that and feeling like I was being authentic, that was kind of the thinking there.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I've always liked the name Luft because it made me think of like taking a helicopter view and landing in the clearing, as you so rightly said. I also really like the fact that when we started talking, you've talked about self-care first.

Speaker 2:

So you've done all your own metaphorical teeth washing, you're good to go, and then that makes you monumentally present when you take your helicopter land into your own luft clearing yeah, that's absolutely true, and and I, you know, people who know me well will probably tell you that I probably brush my teeth about four to five times a day, which is a little bit excessive, but I just it's my, and again, from the acting days it's like, I think, before a show or before a take, I would, I would brush my teeth because I would feel really prepared and ready for anything and and I think, certainly in life as well, you know, I want to put those things into place so that I feel like the world can throw anything at me and I'll be okay and I love it because it's not ocd actually, or there could be.

Speaker 1:

It's much more about the ritual of preparation, yeah, and I love the fact you used to do that back in there as an actor. You went to Mountview Theatre School, didn't you?

Speaker 2:

And even when I go to my mum's house now I realise I sort of have inherited it from her because she has a toothbrush I don't want this podcast to be all about tooth care. We are available for sponsorship.

Speaker 1:

She has like a toothbrush, doesn't he have lovely teeth? They don't want to sponsor that. And as a family DNA, did you have terrible halitosis back in the day?

Speaker 2:

No, not at all. Not at all no.

Speaker 1:

Yes, excellent. So I'm going to get you on the open road of the structure and the construct. There's going to be a clearing a tree, a lovely juicy storytelling exercise called 5-4-3-, 2, 1. There's going to be some alchemy, some gold, a couple of random squirrels, a cheeky bit of Shakespeare, a golden baton and a cake. So it's absolutely all to play for. So where is what is first of all, a clearing or a serious happy place for you, ben? Where do you go to get ready to deliver the awesomeness?

Speaker 2:

that you do. When I thought about this question not for very long I actually thought about not necessarily a place, but actually the people, Because it sounds like a cliche, but I am a people person. I'm probably quite extrovert, with a bit of introvertedness as well, but I think for me it's if I'm around the people that I really love and think are great, then I think that's probably one of my happy places. So that could be anywhere, but it's very much about the people. I think that was the first way I thought.

Speaker 1:

So it's about the art of collaboration. That's not just family, that's anyone with whom you feel a warm connection.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, absolutely. It's family, it's friends, it's work colleagues. It's about that sort of setting and that community and that they create that or we create it together. So I think people is certainly the first thing I would think about. Selhurst Park is probably my next happy place, which is where my beloved Crystal Palace play football. So when I watch Crystal Palace live or on telly, or actually you know rugby or football on the telly, that's also my happy place, because I switch off and I'm just sort of taken to another place where all of my worries and fears are gone, because I'm just literally I've switched off and I'm just watching this football match.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I'm quite excited at the idea. No one in my circa 250 episodes yet has said a football pitch or stadium, and you're not just saying that. But I'm quite excited about taking a sort of luft helicopter landing into the center circle of crystal palace, if you'd like that.

Speaker 1:

Wow, wouldn't that be great also available for sponsorship by crystal palace and mclean's. Don't forget that as well. So, um, is that all right? So I'm going to arrive in a, so there's. So there's your people standing there within a semicircle. I'm now going to arrive with a tree in your clearing.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, and I know you'll enjoy this, because this is a bit deliberately existential, a bit Beckett-y, a bit Waiting for Godot-esque. So now I'm going to shake your tree to see which storytelling apples fall out. How do you like these apples? So this is now where you've taken five minutes to have thought about Ben Nathan, executive coach, four things that have shaped you, three things that inspire you, two things that never fail to grab your attention, and we'll get on to that. That's where I'll introduce the squirrels or your shiny object syndromes. And then the one is a quirky or unusual fact about you that we couldn't possibly know about you until you tell us. So it's not a memory test, you'll be relieved. But now to curate you through that, over to you to shake the canopy of your tree as you see fit.

Speaker 2:

Four things that have shaped me. Okay, so my grandparents is probably number one. They're no longer with us now, so I think growing up my mum and dad used to drop me at my grandparents quite a lot so they could go off dancing or whatever they did. Dad used to drop me at my grandparents quite a lot so they could go off dancing or whatever they did.

Speaker 1:

That's a very lovely romantic notion of where mum and dad have gone. They've gone dancing, dear.

Speaker 2:

Sod the kids, let's just go and have a good time. But I did have a good time with my grandparents and I think in lots of cultures that the child-grandparent relationship is quite unique. I remember I was in India and Nepal and that's quite a common thing, so the parents can go off and work, the grandparents will do the childcare, and it was sort of the same for me and I loved it because it was a sort of quite a traditional setting. My grandparents are first generation immigrants from Russia Jewish Russians so it had this kind of old world traditional, cosy, warm, lots of food, lots of treats, lots of nice things and I loved it Playing cards, going to the shops, going for walks, and in fact my grandfather owned an electrical shop. He would sell vacuum cleaners and televisions and light bulbs. So as I grew older, I would then work with him at the weekend and we'd go for fish and chips. So, yeah, so I think those two people would stand out as shaping me. And what were their names? Sid?

Speaker 1:

and Rini. Oh, I'm so glad I asked that.

Speaker 2:

Sid and Rini and my grandfather's business was called Sidron's because he put Sid and Rini together to make Sidron, and his customers used to call him Mr Sidron. They didn't know his name was Mr Nathan. He would just go along with it and go oh, hello, yeah, mr Sidron.

Speaker 1:

Love that.

Speaker 2:

Wonderful.

Speaker 1:

And where was the shop?

Speaker 2:

based. Well, it started in Tottenham Court Road, yeah, where there still are lots of sort of hi-fi tech, television type places, and then he moved to Streatham, so he had two shops on Streatham High Road and he would employ various members of his family his brothers, his sisters, his grandchildren. He had a van, you know, we'd go and take televisions to people's houses and hook them up and they'd, you know, slip me a couple of quid. So I loved it, yeah, really enjoyed it, and, as I say, that sort of cultural, authentic, old-fashioned sort of world I liked, because I've probably got a bit of old-fashionedness in me. Yes, as well, and they were cockneys as well.

Speaker 1:

So there's Russian-Jewish cockney extraction in the ordeal.

Speaker 2:

Well, yeah, because I think you know, even now, I think, is it the Bengali community? They sort of are in Brick Lane. Yes, and if you go back another 50 years, it was Jewish-Russians. Yeah, and I think, the further you go back, I think you even get like French Huguenots, huguenots, huguenots, how do you say it?

Speaker 1:

Write in on a postcard.

Speaker 2:

please Write in on a postcard, but this idea that there is this place where immigrants go East London, so yeah, so that's where they sort of landed and grew up.

Speaker 1:

I can't remember if that's as formal as ghettoisation, but it's about the desire for communities to gather together. My parents live in Leicester, my mum's still with us, but that's stereotypically almost like a Ugandan-Asian migration place.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, absolutely. There is a pattern, isn't there? Yes, different waves of immigrants go to the same places.

Speaker 1:

And, of course, golders Green, being archetypically Jewish as well, and you did mention, you don't feel 100% English in terms of where you're from, and that's why I understand now.

Speaker 2:

Which is my second thing that has shaped me is my Jewish identity. Definitely, and the way I think about it is. I was the only Jewish child in my primary school. I lived in southeast London, so there weren't you know, they're all in north London most Jews. There aren't that many in south London, or at least there weren't then. And equally in my secondary school there were probably two or three of us out of a thousand kids.

Speaker 2:

You know, I think about this a lot and in fact David Baddiel writes about this the difference between the Jewish ethnicity rather than other ethnicities that are visibly apparent. You can see the difference in someone, whether that's the color of their skin or the clothes they wear or the traditional dress that they wear. But it's different with Jewish people. It's often hidden, hidden, and I certainly grew up feeling like I had a secret that not many other people knew about and couldn't see. So it was always sort of under the surface, and I think that's definitely shaped my view of the world where I sit in it and you mentioned it as a secret.

Speaker 1:

Is that because you felt it needed? Well, I'm just going to ask about the secret. So why did you say secret? Okay, secret, is that because you felt it needed? Well, I'm just going to ask about the secret. So why did you say secret?

Speaker 2:

Okay, so two episodes that I think highlight that. One is again going back to my grandparents and their generation. I think when we were out in public and if they would use the words Jewish, jews or Judaism, they would say that word at a much lower volume. You know, my grandfather wore a bowler hat and loved the Queen and was a very proud British man, but I think sometimes he hid the other part of his identity, so I think I inherited that a little bit Lovely answer. Yeah, I think the other thing is that obviously, diversity and equality and inclusion are such big hot topics at the moment and I feel in some ways that I get that. You know, it's a lived experience, but in a different way to you know, because it's quite invisible. But I do get it and I do feel strongly about it and I do appreciate that. You know how you can feel. Not quite part of the group, yes, and everyone's got different reasons why you whether you, I don't know prefer working from home than working in the office or whatever it might be.

Speaker 1:

But yeah, no, I feel, I feel I get that lovely, and then I've got a bell for moving us on shape page number three.

Speaker 2:

Please, at the risk, of bringing a sort of a lower energy to it. My brother's suicide has definitely shaped me. So that happened about five years ago during COVID and it was a shocking event. It definitely shook my family and shook me. But the reason why I say that it has shaped me is I do think I have changed since then in some ways.

Speaker 2:

And I say that because I think out of tragedy, out of hardship, I do think good things can come and I do think my brother's story has taught me that. So I didn't have towards the end of his life I didn't have a great relationship with him and I didn't see his kids very much. Now I see his kids a lot. You know I'm a really important figure in their life. I hope it's improved the relationship with my mum.

Speaker 2:

So out of tragedy I've learned a lot. You know I'm a really important figure in their life. I hope it's improved the relationship with my mum. So out of tragedy I've learned a lot of really important, an important life skill that good things can come from being rock bottom type of thing. So yeah, I do think that shaped me and I think also, you know self harm in sort of youth these days, not just with young people, but lots of people, and I think I've experienced that, I understand it a bit and I think there are ways to use that, as where are we going to go from this? You know, what do we learn from this kind of thing?

Speaker 1:

and forgive me if you said this. Was he an older brother or a younger?

Speaker 2:

yeah, older, nearly 10 years. Right, yeah, nearly 10 years older. We, like you said, the various ages of man in Shakespeare. We had different periods in our lives where we got on really well, where we didn't get on well, you know, and it was difficult at times, mental health being a big sort of obstacle. But certainly it shaped me and it makes me look at the world and see the world with a different sort of coloured lens at times and a different perspective.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, which is the new perspective is what you now bring in your work.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, absolutely. We all have choices that we can make in our lives, whether it's about how do we prepare for an event like this or a difficult conversation, and I think you know that sort of ties into it with me. You know that we can choose how we respond to yes, in fact that I remember now what I was thinking. So there's you might have heard of it the book uh man's search for meaning yes, by victor frankl, who was a holocall survivor, and his, his famous phrases. You know, between stimulus and response there is a space to plug, lift again, and that's our freedom, that's our place where we can decide to make a choice or not, you know, depending on which way.

Speaker 1:

Deliberately to reincorporate. Just say that again because I heard it, but I think it's worth restating.

Speaker 2:

I think the phrase is between stimulus and response. There is a space, and in that space lies our freedom, and I think for him it was. You know, in the depravity of Auschwitz where he was. Even there, even with the terror that he experienced there, there was still one human freedom that could not be taken away, you know, which is how do I choose to respond to this, and dignity springs to mind as one of the responses yeah and interestingly then I'll stop this story.

Speaker 2:

But what I loved in the book is he said that those people in Auschwitz who saved their food for others lived longer because they had a purpose, because they had a reason to keep going to look after other people, whereas the people who sort of huddled within themselves individually or in a group, according to him did not survive as long him did not survive as long.

Speaker 1:

There's a resonance with you seeing the shine, well, the bright side, if there is one of your brother's demise in that you've now got a purpose in taking care of his children. Absolutely Not exclusively. I don't imagine, but maybe you do. Yeah, yeah, no definitely.

Speaker 2:

You know I have an innate sort of positivity, sometimes quite blinkered, that I refuse to see anything that's going to get in the way. But you know absolutely purpose, I think is one of the most important gifts that's available to us. Have you got another sibling?

Speaker 1:

and I've got another sibling. Yeah, hannah, and where are you positioned in terms of who came who? Who popped out first?

Speaker 2:

so my brother was first, and then it was me, yes, and then my sister, so I'm in the middle and, of course, anyone listening.

Speaker 1:

what you're saying is profoundly relatable. It's not about me, but it is relatable because of a death we had in our family, which wasn't suicide, but my sister Hazel, who died many, many years ago. Anyway, that's the whole point. If you tell your story out loud, you're more likely to live it out loud by resonating the stories that you're hearing, and this is lovely.

Speaker 2:

We being a dad, yes, being a dad. You know and I'm sure lots of listeners can relate to this if they're parents I've learned a lot from my kids. You know, it's probably the one job you don't have a booklet for.

Speaker 1:

Ain't no manual for that.

Speaker 2:

But they're brilliant. You know, I'm proud to be a dad. I love being a dad. Both my kids, even though they're quite young, have had their own health challenges, which again we've, we, we work through it, we're, you know, and yeah, and just sometimes they'll say something that can just cut through and simplify whatever is going on, or you know. So my two kids and being a dad is high up on the list of things that have shaped me, definitely. And how old are the mini nathans? The mini nathans, uh, the big one, who's as tall as me now, is about 17. Yeah, hi, jonah, if you're listening. And my little boy, who shouldn't be listening, if he is, he's in the toilet at school and that's not good. He's 12.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, yeah, great Love that. So now, thank you. We're on to three things that inspire you and, if there's any overlap or resonance, but three things that inspire you.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I was sort of mulling over. Do I mention this? But I think I will. I've got lots of family in Israel Now what's happening right now is a tragedy.

Speaker 2:

It's awful, it makes me really sad and I pray.

Speaker 2:

In fact, I was just Facebook messaging a friend in Gaza who was sort of sharing his on the ground experiences and I repeatedly say to him you know, I pray that they come to a solution as soon as possible. So I've spent a lot of time in Israel throughout my life and because I I hope for peace in that region, because both sides of that conflict have experienced a lot of trauma, and over sort of the last five, ten years, I've been lucky enough to meet peacemakers in the region and it's especially those peacemakers. In fact, there's an organization called Combatants for Peace, so they're ex-combatants, so people who have either fought in the army or, you know, for freedom fighter, terrorist groups, whatever you want to call it and have now, from that sort of conflict combat experience, now realized that peace is the way forward. So I'm really really inspired by the time that I have and continue to spend with those people because I think their ability to see a hopeful future and to fight for it, you know, through dialogue, through demonstration, through activism. I find really inspiring.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, yeah. And also, I remember one of the recent times we reconnected, which was a great delight, was when you were talking about the idea of a podcast, idea that you had. I mean, you can either talk about that or not.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, so well, after October the 7th, I used the metaphor of a snail, I think, particularly in the Jewish community. I think a lot of people felt scared and maybe retreated into their shell. But I was one of the Jewish people where my antennae went out as a result of October the 7th, because I wanted to connect particularly with the Muslim community in this city, in Bristol, and so, yeah, so I helped set up an interfaith group of Bristol Muslims and Jews and we meet every month, mostly in person, sometimes online, and we have difficult conversations and we share experiences, cultural, traditional. You know, there's lots of similarities between Jews and Muslims and I use that metaphor of the snail because it's not a natural reaction for some people to do that, that's very powerful, yeah, and, of course, at its core again as a reincorporation, is the silky skills of collaboration.

Speaker 1:

Your intention is to get collaboration and understanding and ask questions.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, you know, ask questions, ask difficult questions with respect, yeah, with understanding that when we might not agree, yes, but we will listen and to the power of proper listening.

Speaker 1:

As we know, it's not listening in order to reply because I'm right, you're wrong.

Speaker 2:

It's listening in order to understand and, and you know, it took us a fair few months to create a safe space to do that. Going back to coaching and facilitating that contracting piece I knew before we started was going to be really, really important and it was, and it's proved really important because it's given us a solid foundation to go there yes, to go to difficult places wonderful and and I commend you highly for that and that's extremely brave, courageous and and a wonderful thing with very kind intentions.

Speaker 1:

Inspirer number two, please.

Speaker 2:

Music. I feel like I'm on Desert Island Discs now. That's great, yeah, so music. So yeah, music definitely inspires me. I love classical music, I love soul, I love Aretha Franklin, stevie Wonder, the Red Hot Chili Peppers, whatever it is. I've got a very eclectic taste, but you know, when a particularly on the radio where you're not, you know you haven't clicked play on something you've chosen, but where something pops up, yeah, that you weren't ready for, and it stops you in your tracks is there a particular track that you like?

Speaker 1:

do you, gosh, have pop up and go? Oh, that'll make me happy wow tchaikovsky string serenade. It's really beautiful wasn't that lovely see what we're doing there. We're texturing a bit of post-production as well.

Speaker 2:

How exciting, uh, the third inspiration now the third inspiration, I think, would have to be nature, and probably the two settings I like most would be the sea, whether that's swimming in the sea I like cold water, so I'll go in any temperature or being on a cliff and being windswept by you know sea spray, and also like a you know sort of a forest. I don't know, I'm picturing a forest with lots of bluebells, and you know so. So those kind of settings are great to reset. I don't go to those places enough, but I think, yeah, nature definitely inspires me. It's, it's, it's such a leveler, isn't it? However, however successful you are, however much money you've got, or however brilliant you think your life is, when you meet someone in a natural setting, everything's back to sort of square one. Yes, and I like that.

Speaker 1:

Your iconography within luftcoachingcom is also quite a mountainscape.

Speaker 2:

Well, absolutely. And the metaphor there is about going on a journey with someone or with a group of people yes, and finding a clearing, you know, finding a junction or different pathways which one are we going to take and why are we going to take it? Yeah, so, and reaching the destination how are we going to get there? Where do we want to go? Is that the right destination?

Speaker 1:

Yes, Sometimes it can be a horizon and go in that general direction and you will find it. Yeah, a horizon and go in that general direction and you will find it. Yeah, yes, yeah, absolutely lovely answer. And so now we're on to, borrowed and inspired by the film up. Do you mind if I throw a squirrel at you? This is squirrels. What are your monsters of distraction? What shiny objects never cease, well, never fail, rather, to stop you in your tracks, irrespective of anything else that might be going on for you in your wonderful or hectic, or eclectic, or sometimes overwhelmed life.

Speaker 2:

Cat videos on Instagram.

Speaker 1:

What a sophisticated answer. We like that.

Speaker 2:

You know I could watch Reem and dogs as well. I don't have a dog, I've always had a cat.

Speaker 1:

So is this doom scrolling per se, or it's got to be a cat video, because I think the internet was made for you really?

Speaker 2:

Well, I doom scroll I try not to, but I do. But I think it's particularly cats because they do such really strange things that really make me laugh out loud and yeah. But also, you know, I love Alan Partridge clips that come up, you know, yeah, things that make me laugh silly, silly things. Because you know, despite all this sort of philosophical chat we're having, I'm quite a simple person. I knew that, is it obvious. And you know I love, yeah, I love silly comedy and silly videos and stuff like that. So that would be one I knew.

Speaker 1:

I liked you for that reason too. That's lovely, and so more of a cat than a dog person. Yes, probably Love that.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, second squirrel, I thought of those moments where I'm in a social setting let's say it's you and I, okay, and we're at a party or something, ooh, role play and we're having a really great conversation and there's another really interesting conversation happening just next to us Ah, yes, and my ear, you know, I start listening in to that one. Yeah, and I want to. You know, don't want to be rude to you, because you're really interesting and fun, but I can't help think what are they talking about?

Speaker 1:

Because I'd like to be part of that as well, and do you literally want to go over there? And you do sometimes.

Speaker 2:

Well, I have an internal sort of dialogue with myself of like just focus on Chris, listen to what he's saying. It's really important and you know you can talk to them later.

Speaker 1:

And when we teach networking, it's called exiting with grace, isn't it? Yeah, Rather than you're a bit boring, I'm going to go over there now you can say thank you so much, it's been very interesting talking to you. I'm just going to go and talk to that very interesting person over there.

Speaker 2:

And as I get older, I'm getting better at it. Yes, you know, at sort of thing. Yes, I'm always interested in the next thing. Yes, you know, I've probably got sort of programs and workshops on my desktop that I've just created but have never actually delivered. Okay, just because I've thought, oh, that's interesting, what could we do?

Speaker 1:

I love that. So one of your squirrels is called oh, that's interesting, yeah, so there's just an inquisitiveness.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, inquisitive, nosy, rude, whatever you want to say, no, I'm not rude, I'm a bit nosy.

Speaker 1:

Yes, and that's great for being a coach anyway, because you've got to ask the right questions Absolutely, and now we've nearly shaken your tree. The one is a quirky or unusual ficht about you. We couldn't possibly know about you until you tell us Can I have two?

Speaker 2:

Go on then. The first one is that my great-grandfather's cousin was Leon Trotsky. Oh yeah, so my family's very proud of that. You know I'm not a political leader, I won't start a revolution, but we're all very proud of my family and sort of quite smug that we've got such an unusual, interesting connection.

Speaker 1:

What's the track? Yeah, ice Pit in his ear hole. Who's that by? Oh, I don't know the track. He had an ice pick in his ear hole. Yeah, who's that by? Oh, I don't know the track. Trotsky, he got an ice pick in his ear hole, dan, you'll know what to do so that's a great fact. So just give us the relationship again.

Speaker 2:

your mum's, dad's nan, yeah, my great-grandfather, so his cousin, so he used to. As a child, my great-grandfather and Trotsky used to hang out, Love that and play in the fields or whatever they did. And equally, you know, I went to Mexico with my family years ago and we went to Mexico City where he got the ice pick in the head and yeah. So I went to Frida Kahlo's house because he had an affair with her and I think that's where he copped it, in Mexico City.

Speaker 1:

Yes, wow, very, very good fact. And you agreed, you wanted another one. So what's your other?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, the other one is that I was a national championship rower. Oh, so, for my school I was in a boat and we were national champions for two years running, which was great. We were very, very successful. We had an Olympic gold winning coach who'd won gold at the 1984 Los Angeles Olympics and took it really seriously and raised our level and, yeah, we wiped the floor with everyone and there you are collaborating.

Speaker 1:

Again You're in a boat. Are we doing a sort of coxless four, or what are we doing?

Speaker 2:

We were in a four and an eight. We were in a coxed four and a coxed eight, and I loved it. It was brilliant, it was a great experience.

Speaker 1:

And I'm very pleased with myself for that question. That made sense, because at that point I didn't really know what I was talking about.

Speaker 2:

But it was the right question well, a coxless boat is really difficult because I can't remember which end it is. Someone's got to steer it and row yep with, basically, with their foot, uh, sort of adjusting the rudder. I imagine that's really hard, and do you?

Speaker 1:

remember? This is just a slight squirrel. Do you remember the story of marilyn monroe and the commentary that was going on when mar Monroe met the Oxford and Cambridge boating team and the punditry on the radio was and Marilyn now going down to meet and kiss the cocks of both teams Anyway? So we've shaken your tree, Ben Nathan Hurrah. So now we stay in your clearing, which is in the centre pitch of Crystal Palace, with a tree. We're going to talk about alchemy and gold. Now, when you're at purpose and in flow, what are you here to reveal to the world?

Speaker 2:

Back to the idea of curiosity and helping people find new perspectives, and what I love and you know, luft, is my sort of purpose for doing that is meeting a client, help them understand what it is they need yeah, you know, whether it's they want their team to communicate more clearly or have more confidence, or, you know. So, working with a client to work out what it is you want. What would a good outcome look like? Yes, then designing the workshop based on that, and I used to be an english classroom teacher in secondary schools.

Speaker 2:

I apply some of that experience in terms of I think the acronym is vark the different learning styles visual learners, audio learners, ones that like to read and write, and the k, the kinesthetic people who learn by getting up. And you know, I'm sure you know, this is something that you do as well and I'm really passionate. Again back to that being inclusive thing. I don't want anyone in that room to feel that this is not meeting their needs. Yes, lovely, you know. So I do the visual stuff, I do the audio, I get people up on their feet, yeah, and I love creating that experience, delivering that experience and, uh, and at the of it, getting good feedback as a result.

Speaker 1:

So I love that. And what's your favourite or dream client scenario? So when are you absolutely happiest? When that opportunity is given to you.

Speaker 2:

Well, I'm on a drive at the moment to be working with more sustainable, purpose-driven businesses. In fact, I was at Purpose Fest last week where I met lots of B Corp businesses and I'm inspired definitely by those organizations where their values are really genuine and they really do inhabit and commit and act out those values you know about being sustainable, inclusive, diverse, caring about the planet, being ethical. So I think that that is the type of client that I'm working more with now and that sits really well with me.

Speaker 1:

And indeed we're off this very afternoon together to the Festival of Future Business, sustainable businesses. Yes, absolutely, I should know because I'm speaking. So, hurrah, I'm now going to award you with a cake. Oh, so, again, don't eat it, it's actually a doggy toy. But first of all, award you with a cake. Oh, love cake. Again, don't eat it, it's actually a doggy toy. But first of all, do you like cake? Oh yeah, so what cake are we going for? Tough a tough cake.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, really overcooked, really hard to bite into. I've got a really terrible sweet tooth. I have to have a piece of chocolate after breakfast. Okay, so it would probably be something really chocolatey, something flopped and slathered in chocolate. Yeah, yeah, an extra sauce, a bit of ice cream, whatever. Yeah.

Speaker 1:

And very exciting. I've just started a new relationship with someone called Anna's Cakes. Guess what she makes. And then, come the day, as this evolves, you'll end up getting sent a chocolate case. Bless you for that. So this is stuff like. Now you're going to put a cherry on the cake with stuff like what's a favorite inspirational quote that's always given you sucker and pulled you towards your future.

Speaker 2:

First of all, one that I use a lot, and my partner and my kids will probably groan when I say it because they're like, oh, not again. Start with the end in mind, which is a stephen covey quote from the Habits of Highly Effective People. But I love it because you know I talked about how I support clients and I start at the end. You know where are we headed. What do you want the outcome to look like and sound like and be like? And I apply it in my personal life. You know if I'm helping my kids or whatever it is, where are we headed? What are we trying to do here? So I do love that start with the end in mind. I think it really resonates with how I see overcoming obstacles. I love that, thank you.

Speaker 2:

And then one more people forget what you say. People forget what you say, they forget what you do, but they never forget how you made them feel. Maya angelou. Maya Angelou, you know I use that a lot in my workshops because you know so much of what I do. Probably what you do is not about what we do and say, but how we do and say it and helping people to realise that and apply that and inhabit that. So that quote just gets it in a nutshell Lovely.

Speaker 1:

With the gift of hindsight, what notes, help or advice might you proffer to a younger version of you, mr Ben Nathan Gosh?

Speaker 2:

Meet people where they're at Instead of trying to drag them, kicking and screaming. Come on, this is the right way to go. You know, I've learned that with my kids and with professionals. You know it starts by meeting them where they are.

Speaker 1:

Wow, I love that. That's really just excellent.

Speaker 2:

And it applies to everything. You know. I say I've used it so much with my kids, yes, you know, and I've had lots of challenges with their schools because they would like the kids to be somewhere else in terms of achievement or attainment, and I have to fight against that sometimes to say, no, this is where they are. Yeah, and also in just more sort of family relationship stuff, this is where we are now. Let's just start from there, lovely philosophy.

Speaker 1:

What's the best piece of advice you've ever been given? Obviously by somebody else.

Speaker 2:

Well you said it to me on the telephone the other day and I've heard it before and I think it's brilliant which is be yourself because everyone else is taken. I think it comes with age. I think when you're younger, some people are trying to be something else and then you sort of feel more comfortable in your own skin. So, yeah, that's the one for me be yourself because everyone else is taken.

Speaker 1:

And actually, if you can celebrate yourself, you know if you love yourself, other people will probably see that as well lovely, and now we're ramping up to Shakespeare shortly to talk about legacy and how we'll get on to that, but this is the Pass the Golden Baton actually. So they don't like it that by Mr Manoring. But having experienced this from within, who would you most like to pass the golden baton along to in order to keep the golden thread of the storytelling going?

Speaker 2:

They're both friends of mine. The first one is Nick at Dylan Bread and he makes absolutely delicious whole food, keto-based alternative to traditional high-carb ultra-processed loaves and they are absolutely delicious and I told him about this and I said I'd mention him. His name is Nick Nick Bildner.

Speaker 1:

Nick from Dillon Bread. Yep, that's going to be a great story behind the story of why does Nick from Dillon Bread call it Dillon Bread and not Nick Bread?

Speaker 2:

Well, I won't spoil it, no.

Speaker 1:

It's a good story, thank you. And then you said greedy. I like you being greedy now because you're giving me. I am quite a greedy person Because I'm being greedy now. Yeah, who's the second one?

Speaker 2:

So he used to work in this building, actually, and that's Mauro who works for Susie House, and Susie House is essentially an app which pulls info on households from databases to work out energy-saving opportunities. Ah, and it's quite a new business. I suppose it's like having a dedicated consultant helping you to be more energy efficient and save money.

Speaker 1:

And Susie, not Sushi, so I'm not going to get any fish.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, no, no, sadly not, Susie, s-u-s-y.

Speaker 1:

Wonderful, like the lady's name, the female name, susie. Yes, yes, I was just trying to find a way to work out what I was writing down, and was that right?

Speaker 2:

Wonderful. And now that you've mentioned that, I must mention my partner, susanna, because you've reminded me with Susi, because she's such an important person in my life and helps me overcome all sorts of challenges and see things much more simply. This is where you can look to the camera now this is for you, soz and see things much more simply. She has this incredible ability to, if I present something complicated, she'll see the simple outcome, the simplicity of it, which I think is a real gift, because we can sometimes get really muddled with the people. The voices, the setting, the pressure and those people that can just cut right through are really amazing. And she's a very kind, loving person as well. Wonderful and great that a very kind, loving person as well Wonderful.

Speaker 1:

And great that you mentioned her too. And now, inspired by Shakespeare all the world's a stage and all the men and women merely players. This is the actual book that I bought for myself. It's not a first folio, but when I went to the Bristol Vic Theatre School, it says in the front cover there, 16986. That's the history in the making, which is why it's exciting. It's part of the show, as in we've prepared our entire lives for. This moment is partly what we're all up to if we keep on keeping on. So Shakespeare now Borrowed from the seven ages of man's speech all the worlds are steedred, all the bedded wibbed, merely players. How, when all is said and done, ben Nathan, would you most like to be remembered?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, yeah, great, great question. I'd like to be remembered as someone who was dependable and I think also going back to that meeting people where they are, I think that I had the ability to adapt to where people were at and could meet them there and allow them to sort of be themselves and then flourish from there. So so I think those two things.

Speaker 1:

Your legacy is secure. And now this is a very exciting moment called Show Us your QR Code, please. So Courtney, in the background is going to be whapping up some QR codes. Thanks, courtney. So the first one is can you tell us all those that are listening and not watching? You've got to say the URL, but where can we find out all about Ben Nathan on the old Hinterweb, please?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, well, you could go on to LinkedIn and type in Ben Nathan and Luft Coaching and you'd find me there, yeah, and then the other place would be my website, which is wwwluftcoachingcom.

Speaker 1:

And any other social media handles you'd like to throw at us.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, well, I have an Instagram page as well. I recently got hacked on Facebook, so I've closed that down. So it's just those, really.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, so anyone getting a friend request straight after the programme. Ben Nathan is actually not Ben Nathan, it's not me. Lovely, wonderful. So as this has been your moment in the sunshine, in the good, listening to show Ben Nathan a warm, enigmatic, executive coach, trainer, speaker, is there anything else you'd like to say?

Speaker 2:

Yes, a very quick story. So I was telling my son on the way here about the podcast and he got excited because it mentioned YouTube and whatever he was like, oh, social media. And he said, oh, you should tell this story about a spider and a pen and it's a Stephen Bartlett video and it's basically that if you draw a spider and a pen and it's a stephen bartlett video and it's basically that if you draw a spider on a piece of paper and you draw a black line around it in pen, the spider won't cross that line because it thinks it's hemmed in, it doesn't believe it can cross that line. And I prefer my version, not stephen bartlett's and not my son's, which is the elephant and the rope and it's.

Speaker 2:

It's an old ind Indian fable of a woman walking through a forest and she comes to a clearing and there's a group of elephants there, big, majestic elephants and some baby ones as well, and they're tied by ropes to poles in the ground and she says to the trainer or the person that's looking after the elephants you know these are beautiful creatures and they're huge, but I'm amazed that they don't break free because that rope and that post looks, you know, I could break it free.

Speaker 2:

And the trainer says well, from when they're very small, from when they're babies, we tie them by a rope to this pole and they believe that they cannot move, they cannot leave. And as they grow older and older and older and bigger and bigger and more and more powerful, they still don't believe they have the power to break that rope. So you know, for me that story might mean different things to different people. For me it's that you know, we can get conditioned to believing. That's the extent of our universe. That's as much as we can do. We do have more power than we believe to make different choices, to break free from convention or tradition and do something different elephants never forget.

Speaker 1:

That's a beautiful story. It's good, isn't it? Yes, and again, allowing people to realize their true, true potential is the, the joy of how you can help them, when you're coaching them to break free of those things that bind us. Thank you so much. Just a couple of announcements from me as we close towards the end, if you'd like to have a conversation about being in the show too. This has been a founder story with the lovely Ben Nathan. The website for the show is thegoodlistening2showcom.

Speaker 1:

There are many different series strands about how you can get involved. The one I'm most excited about in terms of where I'm at at the moment is called LegacyLifeReflectionscom, which has its own standalone website now. But that's to record the story of somebody near, dear or close to you Either your own story we're all close to ourselves or the story of somebody precious to you for posterity, lest we forget before it's too late, using the unique storytelling structure of this show, lest we forget before it's too late. Using the unique storytelling structure of this show, and rather profoundly, my father is a mascot for it, because I recorded my dad in the halcyon days of his 80s, about five years ago, with no morbid intention, but now that my dad is no longer with us. I know how precious the recording and the film that I have of him is, because what we miss the most when that precious special someone has gone is what they sounded like the sound of their voice Wow.

Speaker 1:

If you want to join with me on LinkedIn, you may be watching on LinkedIn. Then that's me, chris Grimes, broadcaster, motivational comedian and coach. But, very importantly, this has been, and thank you so much. That was an absolute joy. Ben, nathan and whatever you do, connect with Ben, ladies and gentlemen, thank you very much indeed, and thank you, courtney and dan who does the podcast editing. Good night, you've been listening to the good listening to show with me, chris grimes.

Speaker 1:

If you'd like to be in the show too, or indeed gift an episode to capture the story of someone else with me as your host, then you can find out how. Care of the series strands at the good listening to showcom website, care of the series strands at the goodlistening2showcom website, and one of these series strands is called Brand Strand Founder Stories For business owners like you to be able to tell your company story, talk about your purpose and amplify your brand. Together we get into the who, the what, the how, the why you do what you do, and then, crucially, we find out exactly where we can come and find you, to work with you and to book your services. Tune in next week for more stories from the clearing and don't forget to subscribe and review wherever you get your podcasts.