The Good Listening To Show: Stories of Distinction & Genius

Founder Story: 'When Purpose Meets Profit' with Pete Starr, MD of Chilli Group & Wayvie, on the Green Entrepreneur's Journey from Corporate Conformity to Environmental Positive Impact

• Chris Grimes - Facilitator. Coach. Motivational Comedian

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What happens when a corporate executive decides to break free from conformity at age 41 and build something meaningful? Pete Starr's journey from Manchester Council Estate to founding the Chilli Group reveals how purpose can transform both career and impact.

Growing up in a conservative household where his father wore a shirt and tie on beach holidays, Pete learned early to observe rather than disrupt. This quiet attentiveness would later become his entrepreneurial superpower, though he wouldn't recognize it for decades. After years at companies like Tesco, Coca-Cola, and the National Lottery, Pete took the leap into self-employment when a friend reframed the concept of risk: "If you have one employer and they drop you, you're left with zero. If you're freelance with multiple clients and one drops, you still have several."

The Pandemic brought both crisis and opportunity. As cancellations flooded in during March 2020, Pete faced uncertainty but emerged stronger, with a renewed commitment to environmental impact. Inspired by his children's concerns about plastic pollution and the collective power of small actions, he launched Wavy – dedicated to developing people skills within green organizations to accelerate positive environmental impact.

Pete's approach centers on emotional intelligence and presence. "You can have brilliant training design and an average trainer and you'll have an average training experience. You can have average training design and a brilliant trainer and you're more likely to have a brilliant training experience." This philosophy drives his work across both Chilli Group and Wavy, where he helps environmental organizations balance purpose with the profitability needed to sustain their mission.

For those considering their own entrepreneurial path, Pete offers refreshingly honest advice: "Just do it sooner" and remember that everyone's polished online presence is merely a shop window – "Every shop has got a back storeroom that's an absolute tip." His legacy isn't about business accolades but passing positive values through generations, creating ripples of impact that continue long after we're gone.

Discover how small changes and emotional intelligence can drive massive environmental impact. Connect with Pete and explore training opportunities at gochilli.co.uk and wayvie.co.uk.

Tune in next week for more stories of 'Distinction & Genius' from The Good Listening To Show 'Clearing'. If you would like to be my Guest too then you can find out HOW via the different 'series strands' at 'The Good Listening To Show' website.

Don't forget to SUBSCRIBE & REVIEW wherever you get your Podcasts :)

Thanks for listening!

Chris Grimes:

Welcome to another episode of the Good Listening To Show your life and times with me, chris Grimes, the storytelling show that features the Clearing, where all good questions come to get asked and all good stories come to be told, and where all my guests have two things in common they're all creative individuals and all with an interesting story to tell. There are some lovely storytelling metaphors a clearing, a tree, a juicy storytelling exercise called 5, 4, 3, 2, 1, some alchemy, some gold, a cheeky bit of Shakespeare and a cake. So it's all to play for. So, yes, welcome to the Good Listening To Show your life and times with me. Chris Grimes, are you sitting comfortably? Then we shall begin. Welcome to a gorgeous day in the Good Listening To Show clearing.

Chris Grimes:

This is the second time that I've been enjoying a bit of a glow up in terms of the broadcasting capability of the Good Listening To Show stories of Distinction and Genius. I'm broadcasting live from Bristol, from Future Leap Studios, and it's my great, great pleasure and privilege to welcome Pete Starr to the show. Pete runs Chilli Group and also, very excitingly, wavy, which we're going to talk about, is part of that lovely, well entourageable cluster of companies that are very well switched on to sort of save the planet, which we'll talk about shortly. Pete's here to do a very special founder story episode because he is the founder of the Chilli Group. I'll let you speak in a moment. Pete, I'm just blowing some happy smoke at you. You were passed the golden baton they don't like it, mr Menring by Mr Murray Cowell, who. You were past the golden baton. They don't like it. I'm a Mr Manring by Mr Murray Cowell, who's the grizzled veteran of the training room, and I was absolutely thrilled to be introduced to you.

Pete Starr:

So Pete Starr MD founder of Chili Group.

Chris Grimes:

Welcome to the Good Listening To Show. Thank you very much. And how's morale? And?

Pete Starr:

what's your story of the day, please, pete? Please, pete. Morale is pretty good, you know, with there's an awful lot of news around about economy and global stuff going on which has its knock on into our world, um, but we're q1 down and now into q2. Where has the year gone? Um, but it's all been good. The uh, the clients are happy, the clients keep coming back. Um, I can keep myself and my team employed, so, and the sun is shining, so what's not to love?

Chris Grimes:

That's a great story of the day. Someone a previous guest very recently said something which I know will resonate with you we are where we are because of choices and decisions that we made five years ago. I was really struck, in researching you, that Wavy your real new passion, tilt and Endeavour got going at the very beginning of the pandemic and I don't doubt it's coming up to five years. So just tell us the story behind the story of the excitement that you have for wavy as part of the chili group yeah, so absolutely right that wherever we are is a result of our choices.

Pete Starr:

So chili is now in its 10th year, um, and, as with most trainers, they start off doing work for other people, being a bit of a mercenary do anything for anybody at any cost because you've got a mortgage to pay and young kids and all that sort of good stuff. And then, as you try and reduce working for other people as a freelancer and increase working directly, everything was going swimmingly until Friday, march the 13th, when I was in London on a bit of a social with a friend and the phone kept ringing to say cancel, cancel, cancel, cancel. So obviously you have moments thinking, okay, what on earth are we going to do? We got through that, as most of us did, in whatever way we managed to, and the tail end of that year was really, really successful. We got a really great client actually in Bristol. It was brilliant to work with and allowed us to kind of continue that growth as a company.

Pete Starr:

And I felt a little bit awkward about when getting lots of money and then starting to feel like I had a business and I still don't necessarily feel like I've got a business it sparked the thought of, okay, what can we do now in a proper business way? And part of that was about giving something back, and I've always preferred trees than people, even though I work in the world of people, um, and the environment has been something that's kind of I'm not a swampy, um you're not strapping yourself to trees, but you have cut some trees down in a good way because you work for the national trust as well and volunteer, and I think that got your green credentials going from the get-go.

Pete Starr:

I think that was a real learning for me, that period, that sometimes you do have to kind of chop things back to allow other things to grow. Yes, and the thought of what shall I put back was about the environment. And so we started off on the journey and I put out a message on LinkedIn saying hey, does anybody know how I can do something good regarding the environment? Hardly anybody came back. Thankfully, there was a guy that I knew as a previous client who had moved into the world of environmental, and he really supported us to measure our carbon footprint. As a small business, we haven't got much, but we wanted to reduce what we had. And then what can we do to step forward? Little by little, had, yeah. And then what can we do to step forward? Little, little by little?

Pete Starr:

And uh, the, the theory of marginal gains is kind of why chili is called chili so often. It's the small thing that makes big impact. Um, and around the time, probably in 2021, my ideas had kind of started to form and you mentioned about the, the, uh, the straws. So my kids came home from school They'd been David Attenborough on TV at one of the cops and the kids came back having learned some stuff about the environment and said it's only one plastic straw, said eight billion people. And it really struck it to me because it linked in with the marginal gains element and personal accountability, which I hold really close to my heart to say yeah, you can't.

Pete Starr:

You can't ask other people to do things without being willing to do it yourself yeah but that culmination of it's nobody's problem but everybody's contributing to it, and because when you get on that that sort of path, you're always looking for that next thing. That next thing led me to think well, we're just a small business, but we're pretty good at developing people. And what if we could help develop the people whose jobs that are in the green industry? Maybe we can have a ripple effect that says, if we help the helpers, or help the change makers, or whatever we want to call it, then we can do our bit to help them do their bit, which will accelerate the race to net zero.

Chris Grimes:

And my assumption there is wavy is this idea of the marginal gain and the sort of wave of impact, a bit like the chaos theory, a butterfly flapping its wings here, tidal wave of impact on the other side of the planet.

Pete Starr:

Completely. We set up a new company and it's like having a second child. It's a great idea at the time, but then you're left with sleepless nights and an empty bank balance and, um yeah, lots of dirty nap just to say to you I really enjoyed researching you when you talked about the kids having come home.

Chris Grimes:

You said one of my children came home from school I can't remember which one which which triggered a sort of comedy notion for me that maybe you should do a register when your kids come back from school. Hopefully one's not still stuck there now see what I'm doing there. But you it was for the love of sloths. Your kids love sloths and they'd been tuning into the environmental stuff. And of course, you know planet earth and, as you said, one of the cops where david attenborough is, you know one of the most precious resources on the planet to help with conservation. So I love the fact that it's come from your children because they are the future. But now you're doing something that's making a difference by you're dedicating to developing the people skills within the green sector to accelerate positive impact on the planet, which is just such a lovely endeavor. And from the get-go I liked your company name, chili, because I love, I love chili and in fact my one of my sort of affectionate names in the family is spice, because I love chili food.

Pete Starr:

So, um, and you warming up and heating up the world of training and development is a very exciting endeavor yeah, yeah, we try and do our to do our best with it and, you know, the clients seem to like it and that's great, that's great.

Chris Grimes:

So we'll keep doing our thing wonderful so it's my great delight and pleasure to be able to curate you through now the storytelling structure of the good listening to show. There's going to be a clearing a tree, a lovely juicy storytelling exercise called five, four, three, two, one. There's going to be some alchemy, some gold, a couple of random squirrels, which is borrowed from the film up well, squirrels. And then there'll be a quirky, unusual fact about you that we couldn't possibly find out until you tell us there's going to be some alchemy, some, some gold. As I say, a couple of random squirrels, a cheeky bit of Shakespeare and a cake. So it's all to play for.

Chris Grimes:

So, if you've not seen the show before, where have you been? But Pete's going to be curated through this and this is the show in which I invite movers, makers, shakers, mavericks, influencers and also personal heroes into the energetic space he's about to describe the clearing which is your serious happy place. So, pete star, md of chili group, welcome to the show. Where is what is a clearing for you? Where do you go to get clutter free, inspirational and able to think?

Pete Starr:

so I have two places, one that I don't get to nearly enough because we live as far from the sea in the UK as is possible to be almost, but I do like being near water. My regular happy place, either physically or mentally, is just at the bottom end of our garden. On a day like today, with the sun shining, cup of tea in hand, just sitting and relaxing.

Chris Grimes:

I love the localness of that. At the very bottom of my garden. There's a worm at the bottom of the garden and its name is Wiggly Woo. My daughter is a primary school teacher and she was singing that just yesterday. So whereabouts is your garden, pete Stark?

Pete Starr:

Yeah, so it's not a very big garden or a grand garden, just to put some caveat.

Chris Grimes:

It's not an arboretum, it's not so.

Pete Starr:

I am a Manchester lad who moved down to a place called Penkridge, which is in South Staffordshire, 20-something years ago, so my happy place is about 50 feet down in the bottom of the garden, just behind a rhododendron bush, and wedged in between that rhododendron bush and us is also a magnolia, which is possibly one of my favourite trees.

Chris Grimes:

Oh, there's a lovely sense evocation there for the smell of all of those things. I love the fact that if we lose you, you're hiding me. You're hiding behind the shrubbery at the bottom of your garden, which is lovely. Um, just also, you said one of the children came home. You can't remember which one. How many children do you have? It sounds like you've got thousands because you couldn't remember which one I've got two, two, but the ending together they're both girls.

Pete Starr:

Yeah, it was probably the youngest, but I just can't be sure, chris?

Chris Grimes:

No worries, I wasn't going to. That'll be the last time. I was just being facetious. So here we are. Then we're at the bottom of your garden, which is very appropriate now, because I'm going to bring a tree which you've probably already got your tree to see which storytelling apples fall out. How do you like these apples? And this is now where you're kind enough to have thought about the four things that have shaped you, three things that inspire you, two things that never fail to grab your attention. And then the quirky or unusual fact. It's not a memory test, but over to you to shake the canopy of your tree as you see fit.

Pete Starr:

Thank you very much. So when I think about what sorts of things have shaped me over the course of the last few days of thinking about it, different things have popped into my head. So what pops into my head now? I think we're all shaped by our childhood for better or for worse, and I grew up in the 1970s. I had two older brothers. To say that we were conservative, with a small C and big C household is probably fair. We lived on a council estate called Withinshore, which also kind of shapes you in a certain way, and in those days I probably didn't necessarily know where my place was and I had quite a conforming, the other C that I'm going to add in. I was brought up as Catholic, so that's how all the C's you either become a priest or you become an entrepreneur.

Pete Starr:

There's no in between. With that sort of background, um, and I think that I was always um, I was always the quiet one, the introvert, in our, in our house, and I kind of observed I never liked disruption. Uh, my oldest brother and my dad used to spark off as as alpha males do. Um, and I kind of observed, I never liked disruption. My eldest brother and my dad used to spark off as alpha males do, and I always wanted harmony. So from a very early age, I was the person who was not saying much but sussing everything out. And I often say I learned how to be somebody based on not doing what my other brothers did. You know, it wasn't that I was following the role model, I was following what they weren't, almost.

Chris Grimes:

So you're the antithesis to your family.

Pete Starr:

I'm the black sheep, but very different, very different family makeup and I think that shaped me. But that conforming element my dad this will become therapeutic now, Chris. My dad used to wear a shirt and tie on holiday on the beach, so we come from that type of environment. It wasn't everyday, but that's very relatable.

Chris Grimes:

My own dad was the same.

Pete Starr:

So I grew up in a place where conformity don't talk about stuff, sweet things under the carpet, just get your head down and carry on. Do well at school, da-da-da-da-da. Then I remember my dad saying when I was 18, going to university wasn't necessarily a thing and I'd fallen out of love with education at that point, or what job would you want to do for the rest of your life? I thought there's no job I want to do for the rest of my life. My goodness, that just scares the hell out of me. Yes, so I think, from a perspective of forming me, that conforming youth probably up to about 22, 23, is what has formed the second half of my life, if you like, of not conforming and not doing the same thing Monday to Friday every single week and going to the same places and doing the same hobbies Monday to Friday every single week, and going to the same places and doing the same hobbies, etc. Etc. So I think that's been the foundation of who I am, as it is with most people.

Chris Grimes:

And a characteristic of an entrepreneur to be a maverick and swim in a different direction and be the outlier able to be super objective, a bit like you watching your brothers with sort of stealth and deep listening.

Pete Starr:

Yeah, yeah, absolutely, and the word entrepreneur never, even, never, came into my vocabulary until I was in the 30s. I only thought about working for myself when I was maybe 33, 34. But I knew nobody who had done that. Everybody I knew had been in the kind of corporate world or just have a job for.

Chris Grimes:

Or a priest.

Pete Starr:

Or a priest, which isn't necessarily got the greatest reputation anymore, but yeah, so I didn't really have a path that I knew how to do it. So when I did start working for myself when I was 41, it was a bit of a blueprint, um so what did you do to conform before you were 41?

Chris Grimes:

because that I am surprised that you only started the entrepreneurship when you were 41 yeah.

Pete Starr:

So, um, I'd worked as a real potted history, worked at Tesco for five years, took a career break so I traveled for two years work, travel, work, travel. Then I was 26 ish and I thought I better get a proper job. And then I got into the kind of sales and account management and people management in a corporate sort of way, um, and worked for Coca-Cola, worked for Camelot, the National Lottery and Bulma's side and a few others, um, and it was. I've been made redundant a couple of times. I knew that I wanted to do training and coaching, but I didn't know how to do it in a way that could pay the mortgages as well. I've got a wife. I don't know if my wife's going to listen to this she probably wouldn't but she financial security is right at the top of her set of values. She doesn't want any kind of risk.

Chris Grimes:

Yeah.

Pete Starr:

So going to work for myself, with all of the risk that is involved of that of which there is plenty was a real kind of turning point in my life and our life as a family in terms of kind of direction that we took.

Chris Grimes:

Yes, what I also really admire in having researched you is the moment in 2020 when you got the big job rather than sitting back and going, oh hey, financial security. That's when you tilted and pivoted into genuinely wanting to make a difference with what you're doing with Wavy and another thing that shaped you. Now please.

Pete Starr:

Another thing that shaped me when I think about people. I've not got a wide circle of friends, you know, but I do a lot with work so you kind of I'm naturally a little bit more introverted so I kind of shut down my social batteries a little bit. But I've really been been really fortunate throughout different phases of my life to have really significant friends that have really shaped me. So from a school age my kind of best mate from school, andy um, just did loads together and just kind of gelled and then after school and college he was the one that I kept in touch with. So we just did like skateboarding and go-karting and paintballing and just stupid stuff really what a great friend.

Pete Starr:

Andy sounds like everyone's kind of friend yeah, yeah, and, and he is he, he is the stereotype. Oh, he was. He passed away about 18 months ago. Um, he, he was the stereotypical salesperson you know where, talks for england and has zero listening capability.

Chris Grimes:

Um, but from all through like a lovely tribute and I'm so sorry he's not there anymore.

Pete Starr:

Yeah, yeah, it's been tough because of that, because of what he meant, but he lived his life. He didn't leave anything in doubt. It was if I want to do something, I'm going to find a way to do it. So that was great because we did loads of things together. And then mid to late 20s, when I came back from my traveling, I got into cricket. I liked cricket as a kid, did some cricket and I met another friend there, mike, who we used to go out with and what have you.

Pete Starr:

But that kind of sphere of time around the cricket team where I was captain for the cricket team for a little while, with such strange personalities and cricket, most sports bring different people from different backgrounds together. You know, we had heart surgeons, we had head teachers, we had drug dealers, we had a whole host of different people. This is the South Manchester cricket team and for me, kind of not experiencing that range of strong personalities as well and then trying to captain them really kind of shaped me and of strong personalities as well and then trying to catch them really kind of shaped me. And mike has been a key part of that and continues to be now, um, and then latterly probably the first person I met as a true entrepreneur. Graham has his own business and has it for for years. Um, we used to talk every day and he, he would talk about stuff and I would. I would listen because I'm a listener, and da-da-da, no-transcript.

Chris Grimes:

So he was in the cricket team.

Pete Starr:

No, he was a local guy to where I live now and the husband of my wife's friend. That's how we got together so kind of. The people who have shaped me through periods of my life have been the ones who have been most important, I guess.

Chris Grimes:

Yes, and again sorry to hear about Andy's demise. Do you mind me asking what happened to him?

Pete Starr:

Yeah, andy, at school, um, you know, council school. What do you do at break time? You play football. Um, and andy, because he'd had a heart condition when he was young. He had a hole in the heart that he had patched up. He was terrible at sport so he was always the last kid that was picked and he always had to go in goal. But he would give it a go. You know he'd give it a go. So he's always had heart issues. But then being a salesman that he was driving 50 000 miles a year, lifestyle and all that sort of stuff not great. And the good thing is he died very, very quickly. So the fact that he went quickly, no pain, which was great wonderful shapeage you so much.

Chris Grimes:

Now we're on to three things that inspire you, Pete Starr.

Pete Starr:

What inspires me? Yes, so wife and kids. So, from going to be working for myself, my wife's motivation of I'll support you but don't put the house under jeopardy, otherwise I'm off. Those words weren't used, but were intimated. House under jeopardy, otherwise I'm off. Those words weren't used, but were intimated. That was motivational. But she started working for herself as well at the same time. So we both went from corporate, both going into self-employment and working for ourselves. So it was an interesting time, but she's always had her back on it. And then kids. Yeah, I'm a better person because I'm a father. I think I'm a better person because I'm a father of daughters, bearing in mind my very male upbringing and we have a family tree thing that kind of goes back a few hundred years and there's very few females in our lineage. So to have two daughters was a bit of a surprise. Yes, what? What do I do with this?

Chris Grimes:

um, but that has, that has been one of the things that has improved me as a person, no end and very profound, that there's sort of a mother earth, mother nature element to what you're doing in terms of your own creative endeavors as well. So that sort of female mother earth, mother nature element to what you're doing in terms of your own creative endeavors as well, so that sort of female energy is is obviously incredibly important to you, yeah, yeah, yeah, without that, if you.

Pete Starr:

If you look at the big five personality traits, I am probably slightly towards the more feminine side than the masculine side, and I'm I'm cool with that. That's okay.

Chris Grimes:

And I used to.

Pete Starr:

I used to not be cool with that. That's okay. And I used to not be cool with that.

Chris Grimes:

And that's self-awareness and wisdom, and that is the holy grail right there. Wonderful. Any other things to talk about inspiration before we get on to the squirrels? So would you like to say anything else about inspirations?

Pete Starr:

Inspirations. I think, just from a personal perspective of what's inside, I think I do get a little bored and I do kind of fight back against kind of monotony a little bit and I think things and this probably links into squirrels what distracts me, let's go there I can. I can be distracted quite easily and then kind of be inspired to think, oh, that's something I've not considered before and whether it's a work or social or or hobby or whatever, um, just kind of go go with the moment I think we're here, I'll give give everything a go that I want to give a go and leave no major stone uncertain. Really.

Chris Grimes:

And we're getting beautifully onto segwaying towards legacy as well, which is coming a bit later too. So let's explicitly go to what are the current shiny object syndromes in your life? What are your current squirrels of distraction?

Pete Starr:

I think, in terms of squirrels and things that distract me, biscuits, one of the things, one of the things, um, and particularly if it's any time between nine o'clock and 11 30, um, or from maybe 1 30 through till four that's a long, that's a long period of biscuits.

Chris Grimes:

I love that. So it's biscuit o'clock for most of your day, by the sound of it it can be. It can be, so it takes a lot of resolve to stay away from them and you've made me think of the word gary baldy, which I've not thought of for many years. But what's your favorite biscuit?

Pete Starr:

please, pete star now, this could be the most controversial part of this whole podcast. You do realize this. Um, the best posh biscuit is a chopped chocolate hobnob, but they're quite expensive. The best utility biscuit for me is a bourbon biscuit utility biscuits are us.

Chris Grimes:

I love that beautifully put. Couldn't put it better myself. Lovely. And now a quirkier, unusual fact about you. We couldn't possibly know about you until you tell us um.

Pete Starr:

So as one of the bright and shinies when I was 26 or 27 I was working um as a sales person for Bulma Cider and I used to cover the pubs and clubs of Manchester and I'd moved into my first house and I had a bit of time on my hands and I thought what am I going to do with my time? And I'd not had education since college. So I thought you know, I'll do some adult learning at college. So I went to Salford College for an open day, no idea what I was going to do. I had a walk around um ended up at the stand that was for a reflexology course. So I am an officially a qualified reflexologist after completing a nine-month adult learning session back in the 90s.

Chris Grimes:

And how old were you when you went to this sort of trade fair exhibition of future work potential?

Pete Starr:

Yeah, 26 or 27 years old.

Chris Grimes:

Love that, and I love the randomness of whichever stand you ended up parked at, that's what you ended up doing. So do you still practice reflexology to this day? Because you're very versatile if you do.

Pete Starr:

Practice it? Probably not. My kids do enjoy a foot massage because they know that I can do it. Yes, so yeah, it's still in the locker. It doesn't count very often, but it's still in the locker.

Chris Grimes:

What a precious dad you are. Foot massages are us. I love that. And how old are your daughters now?

Pete Starr:

They are 19 and 15. Wow.

Chris Grimes:

Because when you first started this, our conversation, they were in nappies. Coming back from school talking about sloths is their path, but now they're 15 and 19. How glorious.

Pete Starr:

Almost real grownups.

Chris Grimes:

With no stabilizers. Full adulthood. I love that. We've shaken your tree, hurrah, and now we stay in the clearing. Move away from the tree. Next we talk about alchemy and gold when you're at purpose and in flow. Pete Starr MD.

Pete Starr:

Founder of the Chili Group what are you absolutely happiest doing in what you're here to reveal to the world? There's an in and an outside of work on this, chris. Outside of work golf, cricket, running.

Chris Grimes:

Those things are where I love the bish bash boshness of that Golf cricket running.

Pete Starr:

Those sort of things are just where you can lose, because for me, the flow is where you lose your mind and you're not conscious of stuff, and those are the things where I can kind of lose my mind and be there From a work perspective. And this drives my colleagues Lucy and jen and lucy, mad. Um, I came into this because I enjoy training, I enjoy coaching, I enjoy that one-on-one or group interaction and when you run a business as you want to grow the business, you have to do less of the doing, but it's the doing that I love. And when I'm in those those places, I lose everything else and I can shut off and just think about the people that are in the room. Um, and that's why, at the end of the day, you're exhausted. At the end of the day, you open your emails you got 50 emails and do that but you don't care because I've been doing the thing that I feel I'm probably best at from a work perspective.

Chris Grimes:

I love that you were able to completely lock in, because that's what you love the most, and you've reminded me of that lovely quote, which is all about you the best resource a good facilitator can bring into the room is themselves and just lock in and and be there and be present. So I'm very struck with your ability to be truly present in that regard too.

Pete Starr:

Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely it's. Um, I it's. I think you owe it to yourself, you owe it to the delegates, you owe it to the client. Yeah, because you can have in my view, you can have brilliant training design and an average trainer and you'll have an average training experience. Yeah, you can have average training design and a brilliant trainer and you're more likely to have a brilliant training experience. Yes, so that person in the room is fundamental to the outcomes that you're looking to get.

Chris Grimes:

And I know that at Chile, even before you got going with the Green Credentials, with Wavy, you lean heavily, you say, into leadership, sales and service teams, where emotional intelligence is especially powerful, is the raison d'etre and the main cut and thrust of Chile.

Pete Starr:

Yeah, I think emotional intelligence cuts across almost every performance aspect, certainly corporate performance, because you know it starts, as you well know, about self-awareness and self-management. So if you can't be aware of who you are and your strengths and weaknesses, et cetera, and manage yourself and manage the things that you do, then you're probably not going to do that well. Well, certainly you're probably not going to do that well, or certainly you're not going to do that well consistently over time and I love that.

Chris Grimes:

And the tilt and the pivot into wavy, where you are dedicated developing people skills within the green sectors. And again to, I just want to deliberately reincorporate this to accelerate positive impact on the planet and I love the fact that that's ingrained in your family's perspective as well. And again, that brilliant statistic of you know one, it's only one plastic straw said eight billion people.

Pete Starr:

Yeah, absolutely within within chile, we've been planting trees and offsetting carbon for a while and I worked I don't know 11 000 trees, if you like. So we, we operate as a business overall in in as as sustainable a way as we can, but Wavy just kind of takes it to that next level of working specifically with green organizations or green teams or ESG people et cetera, et cetera, who have got a really kind of clear direction of environmental sustainability.

Chris Grimes:

And the purpose imperative is really golden in that.

Pete Starr:

In Wavy in particular.

Chris Grimes:

Yes, yes, and presumably the margins are lower for you because you're helping people who are there because of their purpose and they're not there because it's necessarily a cash-rich part of the industry.

Pete Starr:

Yeah, I think it's fair to say that we have much more flexibility in that because we work with NGOs and some charity organisations and the like, and again, it's one of those challenges. You want to help. Yes, you also need to make money so you can continue to help, and that's one of the things that we help organizations do, because in that green sector there's a lot of people who have got that giving mentality. But sometimes you need to make profit and profit can be a bit of a dirty word, but you need to make profit and profit can be a bit of a dirty word, but you need to make profit so that you can continue to reinvest and continue to do the thing that you do and it is that purpose imperative of.

Chris Grimes:

I know you'll have heard of this, but that lovely ikigai japanese construct about what the world needs, what you love, what you're brilliant at and also that can attract money, is everybody's lucky sweet spot if you can find that, and I'm delighted for you that you have, and obviously I'm really enjoying this endeavor with what I'm up to with this too, with that same purpose imperative. So thank you for the alchemy and golden. Now I'm going to award you with a cake at pizza. So do you like cake? Just before we talk about and riff on cake as a storytelling metaphor, I love cake.

Chris Grimes:

I love cake more than biscuits, but I, yeah, I, yeah, I mean you mentioned the hob knobs and the and the and the, not the gary, but I said gary boards and you said chocolate ob knobs. So what's the cake of choice, please?

Pete Starr:

um, reasonably flexible um. However, if it's a cake that's got a lot of buttercream on it, fantastic. But my birthday cake that if I don't have I get very moody at home is a Colin the Caterpillar.

Chris Grimes:

Nom nom Without naming the brand. That's the Tesco special, isn't it?

Pete Starr:

Well, no, it was created by Marks Spencer.

Chris Grimes:

Oh, awkward.

Pete Starr:

Tesco's and Morrison's and Aldi have created their own versions and I'm not fussed which version I get. Oh you, Aldi have created their own versions and I'm not fussed which version.

Chris Grimes:

I get. You just don't care as long as it's called Colin, as long as it's a caterpillar, as long as it sort of basically crawls into your mouth of a birthday. I love the fact you're going to be grumpy if you don't get a Colin as well. That's lovely. I've just forged, very excitedly in the last couple of weeks, a lovely relationship with somebody called Anna's Cakes Guess what she does so there's a very strong chance that I might be able to send you an actual cake. So it's very exciting. So thank you for that. Now the cake is another storytelling. It's the final suffused storytelling metaphor. You get to put a cherry on the cake now, pete Starr, by Stuff, like what's a favourite inspirational quote that's always given you sucker and pulled you towards your future.

Pete Starr:

One that quote that's always given you sucker and pulled you towards your future, one that I've, I've used for myself and I've used with my, with my kids, um, particularly my youngest, who needs a bit of a g up every now and then. But one that stuck with me for 30 plus years, um, is look at a day when you are supremely satisfied at the end. It's not a day when you've lounged around with nothing to do. It's a day when you've had everything to do and you've done it. So that's one that stuck with me for a long time. Because I can procrastinate, because I can be a little bit lazy. It's one that says, actually, we enjoy ourselves more when we've done stuff.

Chris Grimes:

And do you remember that joke? For all those people out there who think I'm a procrastinator just you wait. Also, you did a brilliant LinkedIn post with a poem about just do it. And then for naysayers, do you remember the one I'm talking about? A really lovely poem which you uploaded about a week ago. Do you remember what that was?

Pete Starr:

so we can point people to it oh, I can't remember the um author of that. I don't even think that it was a famous author, necessarily, but I saw it on Facebook and it just again. It just hit me at a moment. I've recently written a blog that's on our LinkedIn page, on my LinkedIn page regarding productivity in the UK, strangely enough, which happens to be lower than most of the other G7 countries, and I called it the Great British Lethargy, in that there seems to be almost a cultural path where people just can't quite be bothered in a workplace.

Pete Starr:

And you know the pendulum swings before COVID. You know the employer is king, the employee. You work for the employee. If you don't work, then you get out and somebody else comes in. Then it seems to have gone too far. The other way of everything's about the employee and let's not upset the employee and let's make life easy for them, and that's not great either. And somewhere in the middle is when it comes to employee engagement. Often not all, but often people are more engaged because they're under a little bit of pressure, because they have to perform, because they're stretched out of their safety zone, and so that's where all of that theme has been kind of quite front and center for me, and we've been doing a lot of work with lots of leaders of how can we get more out of our people without having complaints.

Chris Grimes:

And the lethargy element and dynamic leads into that sort of quiet, quitting pandemic, almost where people literally can't be bothered.

Pete Starr:

Can't be bothered. Yeah, yeah, absolutely so. Which then links into look at a day when you're supremely satisfied at the end. It's a day when you've had everything to do to do. When you've done it, you know it's uh and thank you for reincorporating that quote.

Chris Grimes:

That's what I was going to ask you to do. Lovely with the gift of hindsight. Next question what notes, help or advice might you proffer to a younger version of yourself or of the chili grouparr?

Pete Starr:

Ooh, younger version of myself. It's that long ago, chris. I buy an extra house would be the advice. I bought my gran's house and I remember saying to my dad I'm thinking about buying gran's house, what do you think? And he said I think you'd be bloody stupid.

Pete Starr:

I ended up buying it anyway. It was 33, 33 grand three-bed semi in fallowfield, manchester, the heart of the student district. Um, I bought it for 33 grand. I sold it for 61, 18, 18 months later. It was then on the market for 120, another 18 months later, and I remember all of the council houses around there being 25 grand a piece. Um, so my advice to my younger self would be to do it, to do it sooner and not wait, and I think that's one of the things that I've learned about myself in the last 10 years, and you know, when you work for yourself, you you learn a lot more about yourself in those environments than than you do, in course. So it would just be just to do it sooner and not worry about what other people think. I used to worry a lot about what other people thought and I worry a lot less now.

Chris Grimes:

And I don't doubt you're able to pass through that philosophy and playing it forward for your daughters as well.

Pete Starr:

Try, yeah, yeah, we try Without being ignorant of others, and that's one of the balances, for sure.

Chris Grimes:

Next question what's the best piece of advice you've ever been given by somebody else?

Pete Starr:

So that would probably be about risk. And I mentioned my friend Graham, who's reframed risk for me in saying that he said how many clients will I get if I'm a freelance trainer? How many clients will I get? I said I'll probably get four or five. He said so if one of those clients drops off, you've still got three or four. Yeah, okay, so if you get a job and you've got one employer and that employer drops off, how many are you left with? You're left with zero and it was. It was a fantastic reframing of risk. That took me from corporate, having a job and having a salary and having sick pay and all that sort of stuff which I do miss. But having all of that is sometimes riskier than working for yourself. If you're working for yourself, you kind of find a way. Once you're through the first couple of years, you kind of find a way.

Chris Grimes:

And once you're through the first couple years, you kind of find a way and you find a freedom implicit in that, even though it's a, everyone perceives it as a riskier freedom, but actually it's an incredibly liberating fly by the seat of your pants. Freedom which I relate to with a lot of comedy improvisation that I do which is all about yes and yes and yes, and as opposed to no but no but no but so yes, that that reframing is so important, wonderful. So now we're ramping up shortly to talk about Shakespeare. This is the actual book that I bought to go to drama school circa 1986 at the Bristol Old Vic Theatre School, which is why it's a well-thumbed. It's not a first folio, but it's my Chris Grimes' first folio of Shakespeare. Just before we get there, though, this is the pass the golden baton moment, please. They don't like it, mr Manring, but having experienced this from within, who would you most like to pass the golden baton along to in order to keep the golden thread of the storytelling going?

Pete Starr:

Okay, so there is a chap that I've known for a couple of years but only gotten to know him really well over the last six months or so, and he is a young trainer who is capable beyond his years. He's a really interesting guy, really nice guy, and his name is Dan O'Driscoll, so you can probably tell by that that he has got Irish heritage and because of that he loves a pint of Guinness. But he's a really talented trainer, trainer. So it'd be great for you to connect with him and speak with him.

Chris Grimes:

Wonderful and is he part of your Chile stable in any case?

Pete Starr:

Yeah, yeah. He's been doing some great work, really fantastic work for us this year with a couple of really key clients, so it's been great to work with him.

Chris Grimes:

Dan O'Driscoll is one of your sort of racehorses within the stable of the Chile stable, marvellous.

Pete Starr:

So thank you very much for that I like you describing us that.

Chris Grimes:

And now then, inspired by Shakespeare, all the world to stage and all the bedded women merely players. Now we're going to talk about legacy, pete Starr, and how, when all is said and done, you would most like to be remembered.

Pete Starr:

This is the most uncomfortable question. I think that the reality is that in decades to come, I won't be. I'll be a name on a gravestone. So what will I want to be? What will I want as my legacy is for my kids to take some part of the good stuff out of me, and not the bad stuff, and for them to pass it to their kids and for them to pass it to their kids and for them to pass it to their kids, and it will get diluted along the way. But if there's an essence of positivity and the legacy of yeah, I did more stuff than what the average person would have done in my shoes, if that positivity can pass through my kids to my grandkids and my grandkids, then I am very, very happy with that.

Chris Grimes:

And you've got the dream surname to go for that the sort of constellation of pete.

Pete Starr:

Uh, once he's gone, that's the star that was yeah, so the the surname star, um, out of our kind of family and boys and stuff, there's only one lad. So, um, my daughters are both adamant that they want to keep their surname, which I'm really pleased with, but that will depend on what husbands they get further down the line.

Chris Grimes:

You don't want to exchange it for a Smith. No offense to anyone called Smith, but Star is a good name, so they'll have to hyphenate. At least that will be a condition of meeting their future partner, I'm sure.

Pete Starr:

Yes, absolutely, absolutely. But yeah, that's the legacy that I can hope to, to pass on is through, through the kids and um, and from them to the others, lovely as this has been your moment in the sunshine.

Chris Grimes:

We're going to come on to a final question in a second. But where can we find out at this point all about you? On the internet, and this is the show as your qr code at moment, please. So, courtney, now we're going to show the qr code first of all. This is, show us your qr code, and we're going to go first of all to chili and how to spice up your training and development. So there's a qr code, but talk us through where to find out chili.

Pete Starr:

Give us the url, please, pete yep, so the website address is wwwgochili, so g-o-c-h-i-l-l-i, gochilicouk. And as with all of websites for training companies, typically that's a window of form. The other good place is on linked. That's where we hang out. We don't do much elsewhere. Those are the two best places. And then with Wavy, do you want Wavy?

Chris Grimes:

Hold the line, paula, we've got Wavy. We've thought this through as well. There's another QR code, which is the Wavy code. Please, fantastic.

Chris Grimes:

And that is wwwwavy as it written there w-a-y-v-i-ecouk and I love the, the sort of mantra of that, the, the strap line, growing brilliant people in green teams, and that's that's a very exciting moment called show, as you queue our code please for those that are watching online. So thank you for that. Now, um, as this has been your moment in the sunshine, in the good, listening to show peat star, is there anything else you'd like to say?

Pete Starr:

um, I think, just for any, I'd speak to a lot of people who are embarking on a world of training or doing things themselves and, um, the just do it is a is a kind of key theme, and don't be put off by everything else that you see. Everything that we see online, everything that we see in the websites or LinkedIn, is a shop window and, as with every shop window, it is there to portray to the general public. Say, come into my shop and then for some of us, our shop is okay, it's got some good stuff, some it's brilliant, some it's got some good stuff, some it's brilliant, some it's not so good. Every shop has got a back storeroom. That's an absolute tip. All too often we can see everybody else and think everybody else's shop window is their life, and it isn't. Everybody has a back room. That's an absolute tip and we should take heart in that because it's okay. What a lovely last thought to leave us with.

Chris Grimes:

So thank you very much indeed for listening and and we should take heart in that because it's okay what a lovely last thought to leave us with. So thank you very much indeed for listening and watching. This has been Pete Starr from the Chilli Group, and I love the fact that it's got a group now, so it's growing in its sort of empire and its desire to do good through purpose. If you'd like to talk to me about being a guest on this show too, a couple of other URLs to show you. The website for this show is thegoodlisteningtoshowcom. This has been a Brand Strand Founder Story episode where obviously, we find out the story behind the story of being, in this instance, a chilli group. If you'd like to connect with me on LinkedIn, please do so too. You might be watching on LinkedIn.

Chris Grimes:

Anyway, there it is, and then very, very excitingly, two weeks ago, I gave birth to a brand new series strand website. It's been there all along, but it's called Legacy Life Reflections which is to record the story of somebody near, dear or close to you for posterity, without any morbid intention, but lest we forget before it's too late. It's using this curated structure of everything. You've just listened me to curate Pete through, as I say, lest we forget before it's too late, but of course none of us are getting out of here alive. So, to quote Dr Seuss, the time has come, the time is now. So have a look at the I suppose, the mountainscape of the good listening to showcom. I've been Chris Grimes, obviously, coach facilitator, motivational comedian, but this has been the lovely Pete Starr, and you've got a very important client meeting coming up too, haven't you, pete?

Pete Starr:

Yes.

Chris Grimes:

Yes, good skills is something I've learned from a very lovely chap out there called Mark Alexander. You don't say good luck, you say good skills because you've been preparing your entire life for this moment. Boom, so I've been Chris Grimes. This has been pete star thanks for this time.

Pete Starr:

It's been great wonderful.

Chris Grimes:

Thanks very much. Good night. You've been listening to the good listening to show with me, chris grimes. If you'd like to be in the show too, or indeed gift an episode to capture the story of someone else, with me as your host, then you can find out how care of the series strands at the goodlistening2showcom website, and one of these series strands is called Brand Strand Founder Stories For business owners like you to be able to tell your company story, talk about your purpose and amplify your brand. Together we get into the who, the what, the how, the why you do what you do and then, crucially, we find out exactly where we can come and find you, to work with you and to book your services. Tune in next week for more stories from the clearing and don't forget to subscribe and review wherever you get your podcasts.