The Good Listening To Show: Stories of Distinction & Genius

Best of Bristol LIVE: Podcast on a Plane! Transforming a 727-100 Series Aeroplane into an Artistic AirB&B Jacuzzi Oasis, with Antipodean Entrepreneur Johnny Palmer, MD of PYTCH Events in Bristol!

• Chris Grimes - Facilitator. Coach. Motivational Comedian

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Podcast on a Plane with innovative Antipodean Entrepreneur Johnny Palmer, the mastermind behind Pitch Air, an extraordinary airplane-turned-Airbnb nestled in Bristol. Discover how Johnny transformed a former Japan Airlines 727-100 series once used for dubious cargo runs in Africa, into a creative hub that marries art and sustainable engineering. Hear about the unique challenges of acquiring and installing such a massive structure, as well as the vibrant role played by acclaimed Graffiti artists in turning the plane into a colourful landmark. Johnny’s passion for upcycling and inspiring the next generation of engineers shines through in this episode, offering a fresh perspective on creativity and resourcefulness.

Amidst our aviation-themed exploration, we unravel the mystery of DB Cooper, the infamous plane hijacker whose legend inspired a Johnny Palmer new Whisky Brand. Johnny shares personal anecdotes about  from early life in Tasmania, a love of music and with running and swimming providing solace and clarity. 

We chat about the importance of personal sanctuaries, such as the calming environment of an airoplane, and delve into his entrepreneurial journey from humble beginnings to an adventurous career in DJing. Family values are at the heart of our discussion, with heartfelt stories of cherished moments with Johnny's children, Max and Will, and the joy that such experiences bring.

Looking ahead, Johnny reveals ambitious plans for future entrepreneurial ventures, including a second aircraft transformation and initiatives to nurture young entrepreneurs in Bristol. We discuss his dedication to creating community spaces that foster innovation and environmental stewardship, such as his river island nature reserve project. The conversation underscores the importance of supporting small businesses and cultivating a culture of sustainability and creativity. Join us for this captivating episode filled with inspiration, innovation, and the adventurous spirit of entrepreneurship.

Tune in next week for more stories of 'Distinction & Genius' from The Good Listening To Show 'Clearing'. If you would like to be my Guest too then you can find out HOW via the different 'series strands' at 'The Good Listening To Show' website.

Don't forget to SUBSCRIBE & REVIEW wherever you get your Podcasts :)

Thanks for listening!

Chris Grimes:

Welcome to another episode of the Good Listening To Show your life and times with me, chris Grimes, the storytelling show that features the Clearing, where all good questions come to get asked and all good stories come to be told, and where all my guests have two things in common they're all creative individuals and all with an interesting story to tell. There are some lovely storytelling metaphors a clearing, a tree, a juicy storytelling exercise called 5, 4, 3, 2, 1, some alchemy, some gold, a cheeky bit of Shakespeare and a cake. So it's all to play for. So, yes, welcome to the Good Listening To Show your life and times with me, chris Grimes, are you sitting comfortably? Then we shall begin. So welcome to a very special Bristol Voices episode of the Good Listening To Show Stories of Distinction and Genius.

Chris Grimes:

This is a podcast and a radio show in which I invite movers, makers, shakers, mavericks, influencers and also personal heroes into a clearing or serious happy place of my guests choosing. Now, you are a wonderful qualifier for most of those little rabbit holes I've just described. Mover, maker, shaker, maverick you're very definitely maverick, because we are sitting in a 72700 series airplane doing a podcast on an airplane, please, so welcome to pitch air. You are the captain of pitch air because it's your plane. But what we must do is find out the story behind the story of why john Palmer tech lover, event producer, river swimmer, island owner, property investor and you're also a renewable energy nerd but all those things why do you have an aeroplane strapped to pitch your event company in Brislington, in Bristol? How long have we got? We've got 45 minutes, fine.

Johnny Palmer:

So why, or how, let's do either of those. Okay, why? Because it was possible. Possible, it was there and I had the space and it was affordable. Um, it cost less than people think.

Chris Grimes:

Um so willing to tell us how much? What do we pay for um?

Johnny Palmer:

I can't not publicly, because the guy that sold to me lovely guy mark. He said johnny, I can't have people knowing what you paid for it. What I can say, it was affordable and most people's car probably costs more wow, yeah, wow people look at it and they think it's all like really fancy and there's all this money.

Johnny Palmer:

It's like no, not really. You know, this is not the money's not the challenge. The engineering and the planning and the logistics was a challenge. It wasn't a financial stretch, it was a headspace stretch and just also to explain we're sitting in.

Chris Grimes:

It's been credited with being the most extraordinary eclectic but probably the most expensive airbnb in bristol.

Johnny Palmer:

That's what they latch on to and they want to fate. In that interview, we talked about the sustainability, the inspiration to young engineers. We talked about the upcycling, the carbon reduction, but no, they latched on the two, the two references to money, which is disappointing because it wasn't about that. There was much more going on. But hey ho, when you deal with um, these people that want their clicks, they'll grab the bits and get the likes right.

Chris Grimes:

And I first latched onto you through Bristol Life magazine and I was really, really enamoured by the fact you said that was a nice piece.

Johnny Palmer:

I thought it was nice.

Chris Grimes:

Yeah, and I have no agenda. Someone thought I paid for that. I didn't. I have no agenda. I'm going to bathe you in sunlight because I'm really impressed with the it was Bristol Life magazine and I remember you saying that. Because you already are in an industrial unit here in Brislington, in Bristol BS4, you realised you could actually just shove anything in the way and no one would assume it was an eyesore, because everything in an industrial estate is an eyesore.

Johnny Palmer:

Yeah, when the standard's this low, if you do something here, you're doing well, right?

Audience 1:

Yes, it's a nice area.

Johnny Palmer:

I'm not saying Brisbane is a great area, but industrial estates inherently aren't. They're utility spaces. There's nothing aesthetic, so you do anything there and it's kind of an improvement, which is great right.

Chris Grimes:

Awesome, yes, and it's got some extraordinary graffiti on the outside. When it arrived to be Pitcher, it was a white 72700 series.

Johnny Palmer:

Who's done the graffiti for you? So that was Hassan Camel, the Hass Harriet Wood Hazard One and the hass harriet wood hazard one and um curtis hilton, who's just a legend.

Chris Grimes:

These, these guys, are amazing I'd like to say I recognize all their tags, but I really don't. You probably recognize their work like.

Johnny Palmer:

They've all got their own group lovely people, so cool and it was great because they love like painting motorway bridges and stuff right, they just do purely for the love of it. So if you can give these guys a commercial commission every now and again, yeah, um, it helps them do their thing, which makes our city what it is, so great. You know, it's a win-win. We paid them and we got a beautiful aircraft and hopefully I've got something quite nice for their portfolio and they can keep doing what they do, which is a proper win. I love that. It's great.

Chris Grimes:

And on the timeline of when the plane arrived and when its last flight was, and just go back a step and tell us the story of how it got here 1968,.

Johnny Palmer:

Japan airlines in a three plus three configuration like, uh, easyjet orion air similar. And then 1981 it was converted into this thing what it is now. Yeah, and then a series of questionable owners had it. We know about one called lars magnuson who recently got locked up for tax fraud. And then another guy called um mark kruger who had a questionable um air freight company that moved around bananas in western africa bananas, bananas, because it's worth flying a 747 and move bananas around. Yeah, it was his plane. Then someone didn't get paid.

Chris Grimes:

That's the worst carbon footprint than kiwi fruit. Is it really Apparently Okay, fine.

Johnny Palmer:

Then all the paperwork went missing, and without the paperwork you can't fly the airplane, apparently. Yeah. So although it was airworthy, they couldn't fly it. Then my mate, mark, bought it, sold the engines, cut the wings off, moved to Kemble, sat there for a while he kept taking parts off it and then what's left is a fuselage which actually has no real value. It's just quite literally scrap.

Chris Grimes:

And when we first met, I was talking about a very iconic Robbie Williams film or video where he's standing on the wing of an airplane in a graveyard in I think it's in the Nevada desert somewhere where all? Planes go to die. Does anyone know where that is, that place?

Johnny Palmer:

Is it Arizona or Nevada?

Audience 1:

Somewhere very hot and dry.

Audience 2:

Lots of B-52 bombers are there. What was that?

Chris Grimes:

Like where all airplanes go to die. Yeah.

Johnny Palmer:

I went to Kemble. I've got a couple up there, which is where this one comes from. It was cool, though, exploring on airplanes, going through the cargo holds, and there's secret crew quarters above the crew areas that people don't know about. Yeah, amazing.

Chris Grimes:

And then what gave you the idea of I'm? I know you said because you could, but what made you decide that I will do it?

Johnny Palmer:

um, for me, feelings come from. I feel there's something here. Yeah, then I explore, it's almost like a self-justification. So this is cool. I don't know why or what, but there's the thing, right. So then played with it. Totally the idea. That was the thing I was obsessive about for six months, telling everyone. It's like johnny, can you shut up about this airplane please, until eventually, like you know what about containers on top of containers, like what?

Johnny Palmer:

it's like no, seriously, it works. So I get my cad package, I start drawing, start visualizing, start throwing sending these messages around. Here's what I'm thinking. And eventually, slowly, after lots of trying different things, you get bits that work and slowly the vision becomes real, yeah, in your head. And then, when the reality's in your head, the real world catches up afterwards, and then things happen. Genius, that's my process, and bless you for that.

Chris Grimes:

It works, obviously because mostly doesn't, but sometimes it does so it's on container. How many containers have we cabbed?

Johnny Palmer:

uh, we're on top of 15 containers, the loads being carried by about five of five of them.

Chris Grimes:

And it's an Airbnb and if people want post this program, Can we talk about containers for a second.

Johnny Palmer:

Can we talk about containers for a second? Certainly, tell me about containers. Oh, it sounds like a really interesting container. You know shipping containers? Yeah, they're called the ISO container. Do you know how much load a shipping container can handle on top of it? Do you want me to guess? Have a guess. Go on 270 tonnes, close 236 tonnes. Wow, mental, what an amazing piece of engineering. And this thing spread across fires. Everyone's like oh, it looks a bit dodgy, like no one container could take nearly 10 of these. And we're spread across five.

Chris Grimes:

Whoa, so we're all good. Yeah, do you want to say anything else about containers? That's good, because we're talking about structures.

Johnny Palmer:

Yeah, it's not about it collapsing, it's about it blowing off. This plane blowing off the plane's actually very, very light for how big it is and guess what it was designed to fly. So we had to strap it down with some massive chains, so the biggest title was literally it flying off the side and it's got all the accoutrements in the cockpit.

Chris Grimes:

There is a proper captain's and the female version, so I'm assuming that people come to the Airbnb and they fulfil those you know what they get up to, but I think they're having a great time.

Johnny Palmer:

Good on them, you know.

Chris Grimes:

You three are having a sleepover tonight, aren't you? We are Me and Simon, and Jim here and you're invited as well.

Johnny Palmer:

Thanks very much so what they do on board, as long as they're consenting good on. You. Have a great time.

Chris Grimes:

Hope you enjoy it anything and we've got a guest here called helen this evening. A good a guest here called helen who but she nearly well a bit of we, came out and we said there is a snake on the plane and I found it oh, there's snakes, sir, plural yeah, there's snakes, yeah there's lots of things. I found one in the top drawer. Did you find the guns?

Johnny Palmer:

no, got trouble for them, okay guns as well got guns gosh.

Chris Grimes:

There's more dodgy stuff going on in the plane than I thought so, um, it's my great delight to be able to curate you through which I haven't really talked about yet what the journey scape or the story scape of the good listening to show is oh, would you like some whiskey. Oh hello, johnny, do you have a whiskey brand? I do look. Look at this just sitting there.

Johnny Palmer:

This is db cooper whiskey available at dbn wines in clifton village, the clifton club stocker and soon, hopefully, fingers crossed fishtails.

Chris Grimes:

Of course.

Johnny Palmer:

Just if you'd like to buy some. Yeah.

Chris Grimes:

And DB Cooper who was he please?

Johnny Palmer:

DB Cooper, 1971, portland Oregon. This guy buys a ticket on a flight from Portland Oregon. The plane takes off, the air hostess comes over, he orders a whiskey, just saying, hands her a note and she's like oh, oh, he's gonna try and flirt with me. Now she hands him the whiskey, she walks the front of the plane, opens a note and it says um, I've got a bomb, I want two hundred thousand dollars and four parachutes. The plane then lands, all the passengers get off the fbi, give them the cash and the parachutes. True story plane takes off again. Cooper tells the crew to get locked in the cockpit. He goes to the back of the plane plane, opens the back door and the air stairs and he's never seen again. True story All because of some whiskey. I heard the story and thought someone's got to have made a whiskey brand and they hadn't. So I trademarked his name in the UK and the US for whiskey in hope that we get sued, because then we'll know who DB Cooper is. It's all a ruse. That's why there's only 700 bottles.

Chris Grimes:

The other three parachutes, he's gone out with one, so he left three.

Johnny Palmer:

Ah, this is the thing. Notice, I didn't say what happened. He was never seen again. They say junk, but he didn't. It was over a forest in the night, in a storm. There's no chance he would have survived and they never found him or the parachutes. I know what happened that night. Okay, he hit on the plane and I know this because I know the 727 inside out and I found where he would have hidden.

Chris Grimes:

Oh true, sounds like there's a documentary in the making it should be yeah yeah, that's one of the other things. As a side hustle you do, you've got a documentary cover.

Johnny Palmer:

Well, I made a little documentary.

Chris Grimes:

Yes, that's enough anyway, let me get you onto the structure now of the good listening to show. There's going to be a clearing a tree, a juicy storytelling exercise called five, four, three, two, one. Yeah, there's going to be a clearing a tree, a juicy storytelling exercise called 5, 4, 3, 2, 1. There's going to be some alchemy, some gold, a couple of random squirrels, a bit of Shakespeare, a golden baton and a cake, johnny Palmer, antipodean, entrepreneur or entrepreneurial antipodean. They're sort of reversible, either or when is what is a clearing for you?

Johnny Palmer:

Where do you go to get clutter-free and where's your serious happy place Clearing? I like to run and swim. I need it. This week I've run and swam three or four times in the last three or four days. I run not very far, just, you know, like less than 10K, nothing hardcore, and then river swim and that clears me a lot and I need that nearly every morning at the moment. It sometimes very social too, as the happy place, I'd probably say, like sitting here with people I'm really looking forward to, you know, jim and simon hanging around tonight. I'm gonna cook some food, drink some margaritas, that's a happy place.

Johnny Palmer:

Conversations go on for ages relaxed. It's a very safe space in here.

Chris Grimes:

I love it here so the plane of itself could be the perfect, serious, happy place it could be, or with my kids or my wife here.

Johnny Palmer:

That's fine. We do movie nights here sometimes, which is great. It's just like you lift the air stairs and you're kind of you are literally in the sky, because it's high up and the doors are locked and it's just like a little hideaway. So yeah, I love it Wonderful.

Chris Grimes:

So we can. Either. I'm now going to arrive with a tree in your clearing A tree, so we've got to decide whether this is outdoors, with you doing some outdoor out, and it's this construct called 5, 4, 3, 2, 1, where you've had five minutes, johnny Palmer, and to pee it in on Trump on the wall, to have thought about four things that have shaped you. Yeah, yeah, three things that inspire you, okay, two things that never fail to grab your attention and that, borrowed from the film Up, is where the random squirrel comes in squirrel, squirrel. Yeah, exactly that. And then the one is a quirkier, unusual fact about you that we couldn't possibly know about you until you tell us so it's not a memory test, but what things that have shaped you.

Johnny Palmer:

First of all, uh, shapes definitely moving country, definitely having a brain that sees the world in a different way to others. Uh, born in tasmania, yeah, yeah, um, born there, not over there, though I wouldn't say. I think just diversity of experiences, extremes of like really poor on a farm, then in my events and djing career going to some of the most incredibly opulent places literally on the planet just that diversity of life experience has been quite amazing, um, and having djing career started when you were 12, as I researched about.

Johnny Palmer:

Yeah, yeah, that's yeah, yes, but yeah, I did start dj. Yeah, I did. Yes, yes, to answer the question no problem denying it.

Chris Grimes:

I researched it and it was true what else, and having kids as well.

Johnny Palmer:

You know things that are truly indisputably more important than you are, or I am, um. So yeah, how many children I've got two max and will great guys. They probably love to be here actually.

Chris Grimes:

Yeah, yeah, they're good fun lots of good fun, those guys, lots of sleepovers and film nights. They do yeah, yeah and do they do school squads as well, where you bring all their mates in as well sometimes.

Johnny Palmer:

Yeah, one night max came and he brought a few mates and we put a whole bottle of um uh, bubble bath in a jacuzzi ever done that, not the cooper whiskey, the whole, sorry, a whole bottle of bubble bath yeah, in a jacuzzi, because the jets, yeah, the bubbles, just mental insane. That was a real highlight for him.

Chris Grimes:

He loved that, yeah that sounds like everyone's perfect party. It's good, you should try it. So now we're going to be on to three things that inspire you.

Johnny Palmer:

Uh people who just like see things differently and disrupt the world. I like that a lot. People who like really see things around. I love seeing that kind of stuff also, that's a favorite word of yours.

Chris Grimes:

I know all of your business endeavors are about three words disruption, growth and sustainability. Yeah, pretty much, and we called you a renewable energy geek earlier on, so that started early, but it's become a bit of a through line for you.

Johnny Palmer:

Yeah definitely other things that inspire me, definitely nature. I've slowly. I'm no biologist but I love looking at nature and the way things interact in nature and how much human society is reflected in and of nature fascinates me. You know the general, the beauty of nature, alongside the tension and the fighting that goes on between different organisms I find fascinating and I and I get inspiration from that because it helps me understand the way humans are as well. It's really really interesting to me.

Chris Grimes:

So you've got a very polymathic sort of a huge range of interest going on.

Johnny Palmer:

So maybe I, I don't. I I don't avoid those kind of labels, because I think when we give people's brains labels, we put them into a box and narrow what people are, and I think that everyone is a spectrum that overlaps in lots of different ways and it's like we say you are this, or you're on this spectrum, or you are this, or give a number or a name or a diagnosis goal for this.

Chris Grimes:

I think it takes away the unique color that makes people what they are and the extraordinary energy you have for all of these endeavors is one proper through line of currency that you have. There's a lot of energy going on here sometimes. When I first met you, I thought this guy's a bit like me. You're a bit like a washing machine on fast spin cycle. That's a compliment. I'm labeling you as a washing machine that's all right, you can do that, yeah.

Chris Grimes:

Okay, now we're on to another inspiration, if you like, so nature uh, disruptive people.

Johnny Palmer:

Um, I find a lot of physics like things, like things flying. I find fascinating things that, while we can understand them academically, they're just mesmerizing. Like seeing a bird fly just blows my mind. Like I know, I understand that, I get it's the pressure differentials and the flow and I get all that, but it just blows my mind. This is possible. So anything where I understand it academically but it's still mesmerizing, that to me is beautiful a sunset. I understand the physics of why it's red, I get it, but it still blows my mind that it's there and have you worked out what and how a bumblebee flies?

Johnny Palmer:

because that's the thing. Well, apparently no one knows this and apparently Bumblebee can't fly, according to scientists, which is kind of funny, I think yes.

Chris Grimes:

Now, wherever the squirrel went, we're on to the two random. Thank you for the return of the squirrel. So what are your squirrels? It's borrowed from the film Up deliberately, where the dog, as you quite rightly articulated, goes Squirrels. So what are your monsters of distraction? What never failed to stop you in your tracks?

Johnny Palmer:

I love Wikipedia. That distracts me a lot and I try to use Wikipedia more than social media, but that's a rabbit hole, so that distracts me.

Chris Grimes:

Talking about rabbit holes, we go down a rabbit hole. I've got a bell. You know a more negative one.

Johnny Palmer:

I'm very, very, very sonically sensitive. Sorry about that. No, no, that's fine, I'll elaborate. Speakers which are out of phase, that's where one driver is working the opposite phase of the other, I find unbelievably agitating like physically agitating or anything that's suffering from mechanical distortion on speakers Literally unbearable. It's like if I'm in a restaurant and the sound is one of those things amongst others, it literally cannot be in there.

Johnny Palmer:

Yes, you have to get up and leave, as in, I can't cope with it and like my wife and my friends who know me well are like is the sound okay for you in here, john? Like it's not, we need to move somewhere else so this is a cute hearing you have.

Chris Grimes:

I don't know what you call it another label but I don't know.

Johnny Palmer:

I just respond to these things and they, they agitate me likewise. Good sound, oh my god, it's good, you know, like a good sound system, like on a beach or war. I love warm air sounds.

Chris Grimes:

It's just beautiful, I love that and in researching you at the age of 12, when your djing career started. Apparently, that made you fall in love with sound music and parties. So the events through line and we're here. Obviously, this is pitch airlines or pitch air because you're attached to pitch.

Johnny Palmer:

Yeah, it's a bit of a pr stump thing. Needed a name made sense. Yes, well, if it's your company's studio now logo, um, you know, I never said that, um, and then the world is dizzy.

Chris Grimes:

I've nicked Canal Studios logo.

Johnny Palmer:

They've changed their logo, though I saw it on a film the other day actually. So we're all good now I think I don't know. Sure, yeah, Inspired by sorry, not nicked yeah.

Chris Grimes:

Good squirrels. If I may commend you for your squirrels. Oh, thank you.

Johnny Palmer:

And now a quirkier, unusual fact about you wife won't like me saying this, but um, uh, I sometimes mix up sinks with urinals. It took some reflection to figure that one out. Like sometimes there's a place in bristol, hamilton house and I'm like there was a sign that says this is not a urine. I was like I thought it was. I luckily I read the sign beforehand that I reflected on this that maybe lots of sinks look like urinals, and I can cite a few instances in my life where I thought a thing was a urinal and on reflection it wasn't excellent, and we never caught in the act of no, no, no, I haven't I thought that was maybe interesting and disgusting, yes, maybe I'm not alone.

Johnny Palmer:

Maybe now I've said that everyone else like I can share that maybe other people are like I. Have this too. I also piss in sinks sometimes.

Chris Grimes:

Yes, pissing in sinks is the new thing to do. It's the new hobby, is it Okay? We've shaken your tree, hurrah, so that's the end of that section. Now we stay in your clearing, yeah, and now we're going to reveal to the world.

Johnny Palmer:

I love seeing things physically get built, tangible things being built Like if that's like a plasterboard wall going up or containers being stacked or physical things emerging, becoming something new.

Chris Grimes:

And in recent years, that physical thing having permanence is joyous to me. Yeah, nice answer.

Johnny Palmer:

I love that. I love seeing things being built.

Chris Grimes:

And what are you most passionate about building. Now you've got your plane, what's your current?

Johnny Palmer:

well, alongside, of course, the day I got married and the day I had my children. This plane coming here was the funnest day of my life. So you know we chase these. Dopamine hits right, so I'm going to do that again what year was that again? Just 2021, I think and so I'm doing that again. Got a great team of people. Uh, all the mistakes we made here we've learned from. We can do better next time. Got some wicked people involved and it's basically you're bringing in a second plane.

Johnny Palmer:

Yeah, yeah, yeah to the same there'll be things that might try and stop me doing that, but I intend to yes, I saw the video of the police trying to transport it and the various glitches.

Chris Grimes:

That happened, yeah, and you had to overcome it, but it involved, it was a multi, multi stakeholder this next one's another level. It's nuts, so world exclusive what's?

Johnny Palmer:

the next plane. Well, so the things that work containers and aeroplanes right, I know them, I know what works and what doesn't, but it's like bigger, yeah, so one container's a bit easy. So I'm thinking three containers and I'm thinking cantilevers, which is where a structure sticks outside another one, and I love structures that have what I'd call a sort of perceived tension in the structure where they look sort of unstable. I think there's a real cuboid kind of trippiness to that. And this structure of design which I'm working with a really great structural engineer, Andrew Barnard's amazing, really, really good guy. He did this one. Actually we're making it so it looks inherently unstable.

Audience 1:

So when you walk past, you're like Jesus.

Johnny Palmer:

What is that? Yeah, that excites me a lot.

Chris Grimes:

It sounds exciting. What's the timeline as to when that may happen?

Johnny Palmer:

Well, we have to deal with Bristol City Council Planning Department.

Chris Grimes:

Now you're already very popular in that regard.

Johnny Palmer:

No, they're all right. You know people criticise them and they did get put under special measures. Sorry, local politics, but they got there in the end with this. So you know what respect to these guys. So I think, despite how people feel towards playing departments, they're actually all right. If you speak their language, engage, have a chat, find out what the concerns are. They they're all right.

Chris Grimes:

Actually, they're just a bit slow that's all, and what else is on your entrepreneurial radar at the moment?

Johnny Palmer:

um, just last week I was thinking about a lot of people in bristol. There's a lot of amazing artists and engineers and people who want to start business, who need space, and I really want to convert a bunch of containers to make super cheap, maybe even sometimes free workshops to help these young entrepreneurs do their thing. So the containers we're on top of now, I want to start emptying some out and converting them. I know it's a small thing, but I just know the value that young entrepreneurs can create and if they're just given a bit of help and it might be like just have a workshop for free for a few months, the change that can make.

Chris Grimes:

Yes, and there's a precedent set by cargo as well. Isn't there, because that's all based on containers?

Johnny Palmer:

yeah, their intent is very much commercial property, which is totally fine. Respect to those guys they've done good work

Johnny Palmer:

but their primary motive is probably money. Yeah, and that is what's known as meanwhile use. Before they build the big thing, let's get containers in nothing wrong with that. But my intention here is, like, try and be a place where small business can start up and fix big problems. Yes, here's a thought, right, we want economic growth. Yeah, yeah, who's our biggest employer in Bristol? Airbus, let's say, if they increase their workforce by 10%, that would be big news, right? Little companies with one employee get two employees. They've doubled their workforce To go from two to four. They've doubled again before they've doubled again. Yeah, growth is going to happen from small businesses, and a lot of those people, I think, don't feel support. I'd like to do what I can to give them a bit of a nudge along, just at the early stages fantastic so

Audience 2:

that's that excites me a lot yes, and I love these people.

Johnny Palmer:

They're nutters, they're brilliant like there's some really cool people out there doing great stuff.

Chris Grimes:

Yes, and um, you're being an island owner as well. Just tell us a story about how you own an island and where is it.

Johnny Palmer:

It's there. Wally wears a swimming spot down near Bath and I've swum there for a long time and it was going to pot because of rubbish and issues. And I did a deal on some land and I had a bit of not much, a bit of cash Not a huge amount, a lot less than people think and I thought I could try and fix this bit of land by making it available. And it available and I realized that ownership matters. So I wrote to the farmer and said can I buy this island? It's a river island, yeah, um, and you thought I was nuts. Like you want that really. Like you've probably given it to me out of my ass, and we had a chat. I bought it off him and then made it just available for everyone to use. That's it really. Yeah, and how do people get across to it? Across the bridge? Yeah, it's a river island, so it's got a tributary, um, that goes around and a mill stream and a penstock, and then there's an island in the middle. It's beautiful.

Chris Grimes:

And it's a nature reserve. Now it's a plot of land you're conserving, is that?

Johnny Palmer:

right, yeah, so in technical speak it's a freehold piece of agricultural land which I think has village green status. It has a public footpath through it and it's a floodplain, Despite what my lovely neighbours down in Clareton used to say and think no, we're not building on it, we never can, we never will. It's a floodplain.

Chris Grimes:

So no more estampes. If it's got village green status, will it have English more estampes on it.

Johnny Palmer:

Maybe That'd be cool. There's all sorts of other stuff going on there late at night, lots of bells jingling. That's good. There's a sauna down there next weekend. I'm looking forward to that bring on the bubble bath.

Chris Grimes:

And don't forget the yeah, let's mention this again the db cooper, yeah, I'm on, it's fine.

Johnny Palmer:

I couldn't do that on the bbc.

Chris Grimes:

I tried, he wouldn't let me I don't care, you can get your guns out, advertise what you like. And now I'm going to award you with a cake okay, cool so next you get to put a cherry on the cake. Okay, so this is stuff like first of all, do you like cake? Uh, johnny parma, of course I like cake. Everyone likes cake. So what cake do you want?

Johnny Palmer:

my wife for my birthday makes this cake. It's got weird. This sounds weird, but parsnip and coconuts, that's weird, magical absolutely magical. It's got this sort of like starchiness of the of the parsnip and then the freshness of the coconut. It's actually actually amazing. That's my favourite cake, wow.

Chris Grimes:

No one's ever said, in my circa 200 episodes, parsnip and water cake. I mean huge, huge amounts of butter and sugar, of course. Yeah, yeah, so tragically, it's a metaphorical cake, but it sounds like you've got one for your birthday anyway. So now you get to put a cherry on the cake with stuff like what's your favourite inspirational quote, Johnny, that's always given you you such and pulled you towards your future okay.

Johnny Palmer:

The first thing came to my brain when you said that was actually and it's not really inspiring it's this idea of hard times make strong people. Strong people make good times. Good times make weak people. Weak people make hard times. It's really on the mind right now, god. I think it's relevant at the moment and it's worth reincorporating that. Just say it again um, hard times make strong people. Strong people make good times. Good times make strong people. Strong people make good times. Good times make weak people. Weak people make hard times. That'll do beautifully for the quote. I don't know who said that originally, but I think it really resonates right now and the way the world, I think, is splitting a lot. Yeah, yeah, it's very, very relevant at the moment, big time.

Chris Grimes:

Lovely. What's the best piece of advice you've ever been given?

Johnny Palmer:

I don't know actually. Oh, you know, one thing that was once said to me is that all successful people, the only common trait there's only one common trait, and that's they're hard workers. I've subsequently learned there's a bit more to it than that, but it's a pretty yeah. But I think that was a very formative quote that informed the way I worked when I was in my especially my 20s.

Chris Grimes:

It resonates quite well with another entrepreneur I've spoken to, who his quote was there is no shortcut to success. Tomorrow we go again. So it's all about the work ethic and you know.

Johnny Palmer:

I think that's because the one thing that's lacking for most people that want to do things is that fundamental thing of do the work. Yes, and is that fundamental thing of do the?

Chris Grimes:

work? Yes, and was it? You mentioned you had a pasta and coconut cake for your birthday. Has it been your birthday recently?

Johnny Palmer:

No, it was back in January. Okay, the cake was that good that I remember it from that moment.

Chris Grimes:

Very good. So all credit to your good lady wife there, Lady Palmer, who does the special cake she's awesome really good at cooking, yeah. And where's she from? You're from. Obviously she's from Zimbabwe, okay.

Johnny Palmer:

So we're both immigrants, Ooh immigrants.

Chris Grimes:

Immigrants, and how did you?

Johnny Palmer:

meet. That's where we came from University. I was a DJ. She was partaking in one of my degenerate drinking games. That was my thing Midweek and, yeah, we met.

Chris Grimes:

You're going to have a great sleepover, guys. I'm looking forward to it.

Audience 2:

Helen's still got a gun, it's all good.

Johnny Palmer:

Why don't you give him the gun, or is that not?

Chris Grimes:

I think he should have the gun For the next question. Maybe it's sort of the gun question. It's such a good gun that one it's bloody convincing.

Johnny Palmer:

I was shooting a real one in America a few weeks ago. It's like that is convincing, that thing.

Chris Grimes:

Yes, there we are. That sort of adds extra grist to the next question. So, um, with the gift of hindsight, um, what notes, help or advice might you proffer to a younger version of yourself?

Johnny Palmer:

oh, did a piece on this recently. Um, don't listen to advice. I've learned one thing and I might get shocked saying this I think that most so-called advice things presented as advice is usually people's repackaging of their own self-limiting beliefs and negative experiences, most of the time Genuinely I do, because when someone gives real advice because they actually want to help someone, it's not giving advice. When I do that, I do it a lot. I don't say here's advice, I ask questions and I encourage them to come to a conclusion which they can come to themselves. I don't say here's what you should do. Whenever someone starts with here's what you should do, be very wary. That's what I'd say. Some of the so-called advice I was given, from so-called professionals as well, especially around investment, was appalling. Luckily, I didn't listen to them.

Chris Grimes:

So you deliberately swim which is another entrepreneurial trait to not go with the tribe and just do what everyone else is doing.

Johnny Palmer:

Well, here's the other thing. Right, have I got one here.

Johnny Palmer:

I'm going to is a good example. This one, if it's here right, this is an sm58 microphone. Okay, right, there's a reason why they've been using these for decades in audio because they're bloody good. So sometimes people do things a certain way for good reasons, because it works, yeah. The problem is it's hard to know when it's done for a good reason, because it works, or because it's a bonehead convention. Yeah, so I've learned it like don't do things differently for the sake of it. Try and understand why people do it that way. Unpack it. Is it good? Because it might be the SM58, not a bad microphone, still classic and actually quite cheap too. And then look for other times when maybe it does need to be disrupted and done completely differently and it's very hard to figure out which which. Yes, good answer, very good, we're ramping up shortly, uh, to shakespeare, to talk about legacy. Bit of a joke, actually slightly ironic. That's actually a knockoff of an sm58. I wonder if the audio people are like johnny, that's not a 58, that's what is that?

Chris Grimes:

a stage professional dynamic microphone I luckily I didn't know the difference, but I knew I knew it was iconic because all of our most a bit like a beta 58, actually All of our most iconic music memories. Have somebody holding that?

Johnny Palmer:

type of microphone Exactly, everyone knows a 58. You just know what it's called. It looks like that, right, yeah?

Chris Grimes:

that is a microphone and everyone's first experience of a microphone. So we're going to talk about Shakespeare in a minute and Legacy, but just before we do that, this is something called Pass the Golden Button, please. So now you've experienced this show from within, uh, who would you most like to pass the golden baton along to, in order to keep the golden thread of the?

Johnny Palmer:

storytelling. Okay, the two people I admire massively in our, in our region is, um, george ferguson, great man. Yeah, also dale vince love his work. They're two really fantastic people. Um, and tell me a bit more about dale vince. Dale's ecotricity. He's a guy who's a bit of a hippie background. It has done well economically and just thrashes it in terms of like amazing business in all sorts of sectors, just massively inspiring Exactly the kind of entrepreneur we need more of. Completely purpose driven too. We need more people like him. We need to celebrate these people, because Britain would be saved if it had more people like him in it. Genuinely, I mean that. And George is in the same category in my view too. Yes, you've interviewed George, right?

Chris Grimes:

Not yet but he said yes, historically, so I'll go back to him with extra Great, great man.

Johnny Palmer:

Again, a lot of what makes Bristol so good now is the work that he's done. Yes, and when people criticise, I'm like I'll just piss off. Maybe then you get the right to an opinion yeah until you do that, shut up and just be grateful what he's done for the city yeah, yeah so your mission, should you choose to accept it, is to furnish me with a warm introduction to those individuals and that is the golden baton yes, yeah, I think they might be up for that.

Chris Grimes:

Give it a shot okay, now um shakespeare all the world's a stage. What?

Johnny Palmer:

you know I grew up in tasmania, right? No, you know it's illegal to be gay there. At the point I left in 98, it's a criminal offense to be gay. Tasmania are the only place on the planet with true genocide. Only happened 150 years ago. And you expect me to know shakespeare?

Chris Grimes:

well, luckily you don't have to know much, apart from it being a reference point for the following there might be okay then there is a speech within it which is, uh, borrowed from it's jay queezing, as you like it, and it's all the world's stage and all the better, really, players, and it talks about the seven ages of man. Okay, and so this is about legacy now. So how, johnny palmer, when all is said and done, with all of your entrepreneurial energy and thrust, would you most like to be remembered?

Johnny Palmer:

um, I don't think it matters. Honestly, I take a very transient view of mortality. We'll all be dead soon, right? Um and beyond that. I just hope my kids are well and, uh, that I live long enough that those around me are looked after. Really, you know, I mean delusions of like legacy. It's like, come on, really I mean, except for like major, major inventors, how many people do you know from 150 years ago? Practically no one, really, statistically we're all really irrelevant. So yeah, legacy not really that bothered.

Chris Grimes:

Good answer. We like it for all that. Okay. So finally, we're going to open up to a bit of Q&A. If you'd like to ask some questions of the lovely Johnny Palmer soon, so let's do that first and then I'll ask you a final, final question at the end, having heard johnny palmer's story. Would anyone like to ask any questions please?

Johnny Palmer:

that means we must have absolutely fulfilled every possible question. Oh, this has been really boring?

Audience 1:

no, not at all. There's energy isn't there, it's just. Yeah, it won't come across on video, but the energy is awesome. Why the guns? Why on earth?

Johnny Palmer:

Well, let's do this visually, shall we? Because that's an incredible. I've never held a gun. Do you think this looks right in here? Right in here, in this space, is it an appropriate prop Given?

Audience 1:

the story you told about the banana. Yeah, yeah, there's your answer.

Chris Grimes:

I think it works.

Johnny Palmer:

Visually it does yeah like to not have an ak-47 you're like ak-47 deficit in this plane definitely okay.

Audience 1:

So yeah, I would go home wondering why you didn't have a gun exactly see. Yeah, okay, I get it I get it okay, all good, thank you, thank you thank you for clarifying does anybody else

Chris Grimes:

have any questions? I know, go on. You can maybe ask what the hell's going on, because you're here for a sleepover and you've got no idea.

Audience 2:

I thought I was coming to Alcoholics Anonymous. Same difference, except for the mention of the whiskey.

Chris Grimes:

Oh, a question from Caitlin Wayne. Do you remember what your first kind of entrepreneurial endeavour was?

Johnny Palmer:

Yeah, horse shit, Horse shit, literally. I grew up on a farm. There was horses and there was shit and they paid me to pick the horse shit up and they didn't care where it went. So I managed to sell the horse shit. It's really good, Like six bucks a bag. Really good fertilizer Proper double win, it's great. That's a great question and a great answer. Then pine cones, then walnuts. Another question. I've got one for you, Johnny. Go on.

Audience 2:

They of a particular disposition. You said your brain works differently, which I've seen personally many times. Um and agree, um, and you're a certain level, certain way of operating, certain energy. Can it? Does it ever get lonely for you? Can you ever find other people who think the same as you? Or I know you don't encourage people to think the same as you, but do you find it difficult sometimes to get the connections that you would like, the conversations that you like, the experiences that you would like oh, a couple of things there.

Johnny Palmer:

so the experiences that you would like oh, a couple of things there. So first thing I found, like in my 20s, very, very lonely because I hadn't found my people. But more and more as I go through life you find some seriously or at least what I think are fascinating people and they link you up with other fascinating people. So in latter years it's been amazing meeting cool people.

Chris Grimes:

Yeah, yeah, so less so. Just got to find your people. Yeah, so you're an outlier for probably half your life in that answer. And then you now but you know that expression slightly cheesy you vibe attract to your tribe. You're now looking for other people who are similar outliers but able to then change by being I want to be around people who are smarter than me.

Johnny Palmer:

I don't want to be around people that give me ideas, um, and people who, yeah, yeah. So you slowly find the people who are right and I think think that applies to everyone, surely, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know the people that are naturally like my kids at school. They're stuck in this classroom full of 20. Whatever other kids they're good kids, but are they statistically likely to be around kids who really resonate? Probably not right. Got to get out in the world and meet lots of people and slowly find your groove and what people are the best mix, the best resonance with you, and then, um, yeah, and then get inspired, also learning how to sort of interact with people on different sort of wavelengths and different perspectives yeah and I'm proud that I've got friends now who are completely different from me, but I really celebrate and love them for that that's nice, lovely answer.

Chris Grimes:

Does anybody have any more questions?

Audience 2:

oh, you've mentioned, you've got your kids. If you were education secretary, what have you seen from their world that is not happening or that is happening that you would want to change, to end up where you've ended up?

Johnny Palmer:

Okay. So I think we should start by acknowledging that our education system is probably the remnants of a Victorian era of standardization, measuring and factory workers, which is not the world we live in. So I'd start with, like let workers, which is not the world we live in. So I'd start with like let's start with like this, deleting the whole lot blank page, yeah, and start with some questions. What do people need in the world moving ahead? They need to be able to um, analyze and break down structures in terms of, like, organizational structures. They need to be able to work collaboratively. They need to learn how to debate and challenge, have different opinions, learn from each other. Um, they also do need some fundamental skills. I've said to my kids you've got to learn basic maths, basic physics. You really do, and I'd rebuild it from scratch and the outcome would be much more disruptive, creative and collaborative all at the same time, much more open-minded, with a basis, a foundation of core skills. You have to have almost like you have to have Almost like non-negotiable Great answer too.

Chris Grimes:

Do you agree with that? Yeah, sure so. Any more for any more.

Audience 2:

Apparently you're a renewables geek. Yeah, what does that entail?

Johnny Palmer:

So I always explain things with the origin. I've learnt this recently to communicate better Rather than just come out with an answer. It's like trying to explain the sort of steps in my thinking. I think that helps a lot with relationships and stuff. So I don't like utility companies because I think that our energy market is demented. It exploits people, it destroys businesses, it's inefficient, it's just messed up. So I start with that A quite negative thing. I don't like utility companies and I don't like the national grid. I really don't like the fact it's owned by foreigners. I really't like that, um. So then I thought, how can I not be part of that dynamic? And I realized that we can make our own power quite easily and quite cheaply. We can store it in these things called batteries guess what? Um, which then got me more into renewables. So I've got a really big solar battery system next door.

Chris Grimes:

when I first met you, you showed me this extraordinary stack of how you and you were monitoring your energy consumption and you were very chuffed in that complete split second Like look, we're giving back to the grid.

Johnny Palmer:

you said, Well, our building next door to us there produces more power than it uses. And this is just some shed in an industrial estate in little old Bristol. And we're doing this. We're told there's an energy crisis. There's not an energy crisis at all. We're making more power than we use. We are producing energy to the grid. Use, yes, we are producing energy to the grid. There's not an energy crisis. That pisses me off. Yeah, that's a quite negative, angry emotion. But I'm you. I want, I am using that and want to do more of it to try and solve the energy issues in this country and talking of utility companies, your wild swimming thing.

Chris Grimes:

There was a thing about you in the guardian in the dock, but you were in the docks of bristol yeah, but they tried to throw us in the actual dock. Yeah, they were nasty to us, I suppose, sewage being dispensed as well and you're trying to wild swim and then the utility companies are pumping them to sewage in. Yeah, you're swimming in the river.

Johnny Palmer:

Then you have this thing called a cso. You heard of a cso no combined sewage overflow. I knew that, like I like. Seriously, really is this a thing.

Johnny Palmer:

This is back way before it was a major thing yeah and I went to the water companies like you, is this, is this real? And they're like, yeah, it isn't, we're allowed to do it. This is disgraceful. Yeah, you're literally pumping sewage in our rivers. You know, we swim in these, my kids swim in this, you know, and I would, when I go camping, would naturally drink from this. You're pumping sewage in and then I'm like I look at their accounts and you made 234 million pounds profit and you're pumping sewers in our river. I got angry. What's this about? You know?

Chris Grimes:

and I've just remembered another question I'd love to ask you about um, you've got a, a geodesic dome, yeah, and do we all know what that means? So can you please explain some geodesic domes please?

Johnny Palmer:

geodesic dome is a structure you could picture it in your head. It's like a dome with like triangles and stuff, designed by a guy called buckminster fuller. Buckminster fuller such a cool name total nut. I would have loved to have met him.

Chris Grimes:

He's dead now, sadly I was going to interview him a moment ago, but he's dead now. It's too late really. You missed it. Okay, fine um, yeah.

Johnny Palmer:

So accommodation is me. My friend, dan kenny, one of my best mates we set this up during covid got six domes down in kent, a really nice accommodation we're trying to. We're sitting down by the river, camping with our kids and we wanted to like think, how can we make this feeling the fire, the river, the nature how can we make that available to people who normally used to like hotels? So I don't call it glamping, it's trying to get the best of both and we've analysed what makes camping so good and what makes two together. Yeah, the answer is actually pretty simple and we've done it pretty well. We're hitting 85 occupancy, which, in the accommodation business, is pretty good, yeah, um, and it's good. It feeds itself financially too, which is good, and how?

Chris Grimes:

are you doing with occupancy in where we're sat in the airplane of being pretty busy?

Johnny Palmer:

yeah, and the last two weeks has only been one night spare to block tonight to make this be available to us I remember that because we lost two other nights before tonight's.

Chris Grimes:

This is the third booking yeah, I love the rule of three. It was completely cool that we got the third one, yeah, which is great. Yeah, um, where can we find out all about you, uh, johnny palmer, and everything you're up to on the internet for our listeners?

Johnny Palmer:

so I'm just sorry. Um, I sometimes post things on linkedin. You know just when I want to. You know just broadcast, and you know self-gratifying promotion on a whole scale. On a whole scale, wholesale scale.

Chris Grimes:

Um, not so much these days though so just have very much so wikipedia or crime watch, and there's yeah, yeah, that's it, you got it. Yeah, yeah, and the wanted post is stuck on the lamppost and obviously pitch is your events company, which is what the airplane here in brisbane, in bristol, bristol, is sitting on the containers next to Next plane, as we've already discovered, is coming soon.

Johnny Palmer:

Maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe. There's some ideas there. One of the ideas, actually, is that maybe we can time it so it does it around festival season. It can take a few detours by some festival sites. That'd be mental. Yes, logistically that'd be cool. Like, imagine that just this, every every week, this airplane's moving between festival sites. Yeah, I'd love that.

Chris Grimes:

That'd be so cool and when this first got parked here as a sort of white airplane 77 100 series, did you immediately know I want to graffiti this, or did people just turn up and tell you, ask you if they could do it?

Johnny Palmer:

no, it sort of evolved slowly and I spoke to a bunch of people and then just like, waited for the right kind of groove and then met, um, curtis and hassan how it will wicker. They're really cool, yeah, and my wife loves curtis hilton's work. He's amazing. Check his stuff out, he's incredible, um, and they're up for it. So like we can, let's do this, yeah, but they kind of evolve. You know, you put a. You think, okay, the airplane container that works. Then the planes they're like looks a bit scuzzy though, doesn't it? I need to paint it. Then you're like now the plane looks cool, now the containers look crap. So then the containers got painted as clouds, yeah, and then now something else looks a bit rubbish. So then it's like you see the worst thing and then, as things get better, the worst thing becomes more specific and then it evolves.

Chris Grimes:

I came here first ever on my push bike and was amazed at how long it took up the Warren roads into the estate.

Johnny Palmer:

I love Brisbane.

Chris Grimes:

It's a really nice part of town, the river's 10 minutes down the road too, but then when you come around the corner, whoa, there's a plane. It is very, very iconic.

Johnny Palmer:

I do like seeing people like that. They're just like what is that? And we put a sign up explaining the story and stuff.

Chris Grimes:

Helen, your reaction was lovely today, wow. And then we pour off saying there is a snake on the plane and then you nearly, yeah, shit yourself anyway. So that's good. So, um, final, final question now, johnny, as this has been your moment in the sunshine, in the good, listening to show stories of distinction and genius. This is best of bristol bristol voices series strand. But is there anything else you'd like to say?

Johnny Palmer:

you're not on the mind right now. A lot is the power of business to solve the problems in society. I went to some like what was it, danny? Someone? Some professor of inequality, marxist conference thing the other night the architect, right Lovely guy, that's a great conference title.

Johnny Palmer:

Yeah, and it just seems to me that right now in the world, all the problems we have are based around two things. One is bad men that's another issue and the other one is people need more resources and money. I listen to Radio 4. Everything fundamentally, we distill down to lack of resources and I look at this and I think resources are going to be created in society by good, honest businesses growing, and I think Britain as a culture doesn't focus on that a lot. They demonize entrepreneurs a lot and don't realize the value that they we have in society, and I think britain needs to change that bloody fast because we don't have time. Yeah, councils are going bankrupt, so the welfare state, social housing. When they're going bankrupt, they can't deliver on this stuff and they need and they can change taxes all they like, but it's marginal. We need more growth, we need more entrepreneurship, we need more money coming into our country and that's, on my mind, a lot right now.

Chris Grimes:

Thank you so, uh, ladies and gentlemen, also thank you to our live audience that have been here for a best of bristol. Bristol boys is live and ollie, our photographer, is here. I've never given him an overt mention. He's lovely, thank you. Thank you, helen is also from ec circle, entrepreneurs circle, and she's a very, very extraordinary, wonderful energy and tour de force. I congratulate her. Anyway, thank you very much for listening and if you've been listening, obviously on the old interweb, if you want to look at the website, it's thegoodlistening2showcom and there are seven different series strands as to how you two can get involved in the show. So, thank you for being here. Anything else you'd like to? Finally, finally, finally, say Johnny, no, we've talked enough. I reckon it's time for the sleepover. Gentlemen, let's get the jacuzzi going Mexican food.

Audience 2:

Thank you very much indeed, and good night.

Chris Grimes:

You've been listening to the Good Listening To Show with me, chris Grimes. If you'd like to be in the show too, or indeed gift an episode to capture the story of someone else, with me as your host, then you can find out how care of the series strands at the goodlisteningtoshowcom website, and one of these series strands is called Brand Strand Founder Stories, for business owners like you to be able to tell your company story, talk about your purpose and amplify your brand. Talk about your purpose and amplify your brand. Together, we get into the who, the what, the how, the why you do what you do and then, crucially, we find out exactly where we can come and find you, to work with you and to book your services. Tune in next week for more stories from the Clearing and don't forget to subscribe and review wherever you get your podcasts.