The Good Listening To Show: Stories of Distinction & Genius

Leadership Reflections: Navigating Global Risk, Building Resilience & Joyful 'Leadership-Lessons-Learned-Along-the-Way', with Carolina Klint, CCO Europe at Marsh McLennan

• Chris Grimes - Facilitator. Coach. Motivational Comedian

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Get ready to uncover the extensive insights of Carolina Klint, the Chief Commercial Officer at Marsh McLennan Europe, as she unpacks her global tour and the pressing risks impacting societal well-being and organizational resilience. 

Carolina gives us a front-row seat to her role in sharing the Global Risks Report created in collaboration with the World Economic Forum. Discover her innovative strategies for embedding resilience within businesses and hear about the serene natural spaces that inspire her leadership philosophy. From mountaintops to the vast sea, Carolina's reflections on interconnected risks provide a fresh perspective on navigating today's volatile world.

In this episode, Carolina opens up about the pivotal figures in her life, including her versatile mother,  her tenacious father, her mischievous dog Ebba and weaving in touching anecdotes about her family's milestones and the transformative lessons from her teenage son. 

As we navigate through her experiences, Carolina’s admiration for diverse cultural perspectives shines through, highlighting its importance in leading dynamic teams. Also, you'll be intrigued by her passion for cake and how it symbolizes resilience and adaptability in her life. From Mike Tyson’s agility philosophy to Carolina’s advice on embracing non-linear career paths, this conversation is brimming with wisdom and inspiration, perfect for anyone looking to navigate their professional journey with grace and guts.

Tune in next week for more stories of 'Distinction & Genius' from The Good Listening To Show 'Clearing'. If you would like to be my Guest too then you can find out HOW via the different 'series strands' at 'The Good Listening To Show' website.

Don't forget to SUBSCRIBE & REVIEW wherever you get your Podcasts :)

Thanks for listening!

Chris Grimes:

Welcome to another episode of the Good Listening To Show your life and times with me, chris Grimes, the storytelling show that features the Clearing, where all good questions come to get asked and all good stories come to be told, and where all my guests have two things in common they're all creative individuals and all with an interesting story to tell. There are some lovely storytelling metaphors a clearing, a tree, a juicy storytelling exercise called 5, 4, 3, 2, 1, some alchemy, some gold, a cheeky bit of Shakespeare and a cake. So it's all to play for. So, yes, welcome to the Good Listening To Show your life and times with me, chris Grimes, are you sitting comfortably? Then we shall begin. And there we are, with a seamless count of four, so I don't have to edit this on later.

Chris Grimes:

Ladies and gentlemen, on LinkedIn as well, linkedin Live I bid you several welcomes to a special Leadership Reflections episode of the Good Listening To show Stories of Distinction and Genius. And Leadership Reflections is where I invite business leaders to share their leadership lessons learned along their way, and I'm delighted to welcome to the clearing, which is energetically where it all takes place, the lovely Carolina Clint who's dialing in all the way from Stockholm. Please, hi, chris, hello, so you're extremely welcome. So Carolina is the Chief Commercial Officer at Marsh McLennan Europe. So just tell us the sort of patch that you cover. And you know that awful clunky networking question. What do you do? What's your favorite way of answering or avoiding that question?

Carolina Klint:

Oh, answering or avoiding, that's a great way of putting it. So at Marshmall Kleine we define Europe as 35 diverse, exciting countries spreading from the Nordics Stockholm, of course, being the capital of Sweden, we have Finland, norway, all the way down to the Mediterranean area, and we also include Israel into that definition.

Chris Grimes:

Lovely. You came to my attention because I just returned myself from doing a career high keynote speech in Lisbon for a company called Equinix. And then you popped up onto my screen where you were on my LinkedIn profile, where you were doing a bit of a global tour, where you were going around the world talking to audiences about the biggest, I suppose, threats to our well-being and resilience, and it's all about risk. So what were you talking about? I don't mean what are you talking about. I mean what was the main topic and cut and thrust of what you were doing on your world tour, which sound very impressive cut and thrust of what you're doing on your world tour, which sound very impressive.

Carolina Klint:

Yes, so Mors McClendon has been a partner to the World Economic Forum in the publishing of the Global Risks Report for the past 19 years, and the Global Risks Report, of course, sets the agenda of Davos, but it's also such a really interesting data point when it comes to anything related to risk and resilience and thinking about how do we, as business leaders, think about the strategies that we need to deploy, thinking about how we build resilience for our businesses, the organizational resilience because the world is so turbulent, it's volatile, it's really difficult, it's complex and risks are not only interconnected but also layered on top of one another, which makes it increasingly difficult. So what I do is try and provide a perspective on these risks that are coming towards companies and organizations on the horizon and talk about what are the ways that you can increase your knowledge about these risks, but also what are the steps towards building increased organizational resilience and I'm super passionate about it.

Chris Grimes:

You certainly are, and it's very, very cutting edge. I mean, even on this morning I was on the Marshmallow Kennan website today and this moment it talks about flood risk, wildfire risk, ai, workforce problems and more. So it's very, very, very on the sort of global pulse of the biggest threats to societal well-being. That's right. So that's an incredible arena in which to be on the global tour, where you are the one to turn up as the sort of emissary of Marsh McLennan to talk about it. It's fantastic. So keep sharing the leadership lessons you've learned along your way as you go through.

Chris Grimes:

I've really, really enjoyed researching you as well, and I've just realized as well that when you the post you said is over the past three months, I've had the privilege of traveling the world to discuss the greatest challenges and risks facing businesses and organizations today. So that's what's on the table here. It's my great pleasure to curate you through the unique story scape of the Good Listening To show, and that's where all your thinking pertaining to leadership will obviously be able to come through. There's going to be a clearing a tree, a lovely juicy storytelling exercise called 54321. There's going to be some alchemy, some gold, a couple of random squirrels, a cheeky bit of Shakespeare, a golden baton and a cake, so it's absolutely all to play for.

Carolina Klint:

Fantastic Looking forward.

Chris Grimes:

Me too. So let's get you going then on the open road. So, first of all, then, what is a clearing for you, carolina? Where do you go to get clutter-free, inspirational and able to think?

Carolina Klint:

And this was a quite easy one for me, because it is really nature, a place in nature where I can see the horizon and where I can breathe fresh air, whether it's a mountaintop and I'm on skis, or if I'm in a boat and I see, you know, the ocean or the sea and the horizon, and preferably surrounded by friends and or family.

Chris Grimes:

but really in nature, that is my clearing, and I love the use of the word horizon there, because when we're navigating the choppy seas of global adversity, it's all about going towards the horizon and being as strategic as we can as we try and navigate the good ship humanity on that path. So where, specifically in nature, would you like to be? Because in a moment I'm going to arrive with a tree in your clearing and then shake your tree to see which storytelling apples.

Carolina Klint:

If we're going to put a tree on the clearing, I think it's probably then on a beach or somewhere I can see where I can see open water. But let's put it then on solid ground, because otherwise the tree is just going to sink.

Chris Grimes:

I have had to swim alongside people in boats with my tree, so I'm prepared to go have tree will travel, it's all good. So now we'll get you to be putting a bit more of a flag in the sand, if you like, not just leadership, but of where we are. So what favorite sea facing vista would you like to position us in?

Carolina Klint:

So why don't we pick the Baltic Sea then, which is where I live? I'm currently living on an island in the Baltic Sea, so I think, why don't we put me there?

Chris Grimes:

Lovely. And just to be extra, what's the name of that island, please? The island is named.

Carolina Klint:

Vaxholm.

Chris Grimes:

Lovely. Yes, so we're in Vaxholm then, facing the Baltic Sea. Of the circa 200 episodes I've done, nobody has ever said that as their clearing.

Carolina Klint:

Oh, I'm happy to be the first one.

Chris Grimes:

It's very exciting. So now I'm going to arrive with a tree, now a bit sort of Samuel Beckett-y, a bit deliberately existential because of my theatre background. I'm going to shake your tree now to see which storytelling apples fall out. And this is where you've had five minutes, carolina, to have thought about four things that have shaped you, three things that inspire you, two things that never fail to grab your attention and borrow from the film up. That's where the oh squirrels are going to come in and what never fails to distract you whatever else is going on. And then the one is a quirky, unusual fact about you. We couldn't possibly know about you until you tell us. So it's not a memory test. I'll curate you through it gently, but first of all.

Carolina Klint:

Then let's go to the four things that have shaped you, carolina and I have to say, the first one that I thought of, which is something that I I think is important to, for, to contextualize, you know, the world society as we know it and where I am, is the fact that I'm a woman, that I was born in a civilized country in the modern time age, and the way that I think about that and how it has shaped me, is that I'm just so lucky to have been given the opportunity to get educated, to have a career, to make my own decisions, to express a point of view, to marry for love. All of this, of this I mean, is quite fundamental in my wonderful, profound freedoms.

Carolina Klint:

I love that absolutely exactly, and something to actually be grateful for, so it's something that I really appreciate, right?

Chris Grimes:

yes, and um, also just going back a step as well, I really enjoyed researching you. When you said that you set out to be a fierce litigator, oh yeah, then you stumbled and fell into insurance, that's right.

Carolina Klint:

I really slipped and fell into insurance, but and I never look back I'll tell you that, too, it's been a fantastic career and I've loved every minute of it. It's given me so many fantastic opportunities. So being a fierce litigator is a dream that I will never fulfill, and I'm good with that.

Chris Grimes:

Also, I love the fact you're setting out to not just be a litigator but a fierce one, but the confidence in leadership and being a woman's advocate is really impressive in what you're all about too, Because I also really enjoyed researching you when you said that you know you love a diverse template. When you're actively seeking new teams, you often hunt down, as you said, women within your domain to tell them that they're ready, even if they don't fully appreciate themselves that they're ready, in order to get them to step up, which is just so impressive.

Carolina Klint:

It matters because sometimes, especially women and sometimes men, but I think especially women needs a little bit of a kick in the butt, to be honest, to take that step up, so happy to give that kick.

Chris Grimes:

Perfect and, of course, confidence is one of the most attractive attributes of leadership. In any case, and what I was really struck with in researching you as well is that the delight that you have in projecting yourself confidently, and there does not seem to be any hint of an imposter syndrome there, because you are there, you belong and I am here.

Carolina Klint:

I've had my little bouts of imposter syndrome. I'll tell you that, chris. But I think it's also something that just fades away with age. You reach a point where it's just you know what it's okay.

Chris Grimes:

So back into the shaking of your tree. So the first shape, which was beautiful. What's the second thing that shaped you?

Carolina Klint:

The second thing that shaped me that I'm happy to talk about is my mother, because she has a very unique perspective on lifelong learning. So her career has taken her from being a preschool teacher to a tax consultant, to a real estate agent and now she's a professional dog trainer. So what that has really the way that has shaped me, is I've never been afraid to follow my passion and I know that it's never too late. You can always reskill or upskill or, you know, do something else or just further yourself. So that to me, has been incredibly inspirational and also has really shaped me and my views.

Chris Grimes:

There's such a lovely thrust of what's next, what's next, what's next, what's next with your mum's evolution? Wow, and how big is her squad of dogs that she's currently training at the moment?

Carolina Klint:

So she has her own Labrador, which is very well trained, and then she's doing her best with my little miniature schnauzer, who is hopeless.

Chris Grimes:

She's absolutely hopeless, so but you have a miniature schnauzer, do you?

Carolina Klint:

I do, and just the other day I was in a video conference call, just just like this, speaking to a colleague, and all of a sudden I get a text message and it's from my husband, and the text message reads the dog is at the neighbor's and I still don't know how she got out of the house.

Chris Grimes:

That sounds like he couldn't be bothered to babysit and he's dropped them off with the neighbors, but actually so where was his geography and the dog's geography and yours? What was the triangle that you had to navigate? No, no.

Carolina Klint:

I'm not even sure where he was, but he was not in the vicinity, so I was meant to keep an eye on the dog, and I have no idea how she got out still to this day. I struggle to understand, but she's something else, this one.

Chris Grimes:

She's wily and she keeps you on your toes.

Carolina Klint:

That's for sure, and she's also cute as a button.

Chris Grimes:

So it's all good. And what's the minute just now is a call just to give her an extra mention. Her name is ebba ebba wonderful. So ebba could be your, one of your squirrels of distraction. Where's ebba could be a constant squirrel.

Carolina Klint:

Oh, for sure.

Chris Grimes:

yes, I think that's Third anything else you want to tell me about your mother in terms of her shaping you?

Carolina Klint:

Oh, she turned 70 on Saturday, so I'm going to celebrate her big and she's a fantastic woman.

Chris Grimes:

Wonderful and happy birthday to your mum too. We named Ebba, so we have to say hello to your mum too.

Carolina Klint:

Yes, hi, mum, it's Åsa.

Chris Grimes:

Åsa. Åsa and Ebba are two wonderful people in your family coming together Lovely. And now the third shape itch.

Carolina Klint:

So funny because, of course, I have to mention my dad. It's going to be a family party this one, no. So the perspective and the way that my dad has shaped me is his unbelievable grit, resilience and always, always being optimistic. This is a man whose glass is half full every day. He wakes up every day and he is grateful to be alive and the sun is shining and people are good. He never gives up and life has given him a punch or two, but he just bounces right back up and I think that is super, super inspirational and it's shaped me. I think I'm fairly optimistic and I look at life with an optimistic outlook, and I think it comes from my dad.

Chris Grimes:

And there's a lovely seven ages of man implicit in what you're talking about. Do you mind me asking how old your father is as well?

Carolina Klint:

He turns 80 in February.

Chris Grimes:

Wow Gosh, it really is all going on the in February. Wow Gosh, it really is all going on the seven ages of man and woman right there. Fantastic, and happy birthday to him too. Interestingly, I've got a new series strand coming soon which is called the Big Birthday Show. So if someone's got a big O coming up, it sounds like both your mum and your dad may have qualified.

Carolina Klint:

They qualify exactly. It is going to turn into a family affair. This.

Chris Grimes:

Now, finally, this is great the fourth shape, please.

Carolina Klint:

So the fourth shape is becoming a mother and how that changed how I prioritize my time, how I prioritize my life, how I look at the world, and I think so. My son is 16. So it's a while ago now, but I have to say him making an entry into the world made me much more relaxed and intentional than I was before. He's been the toughest boss I've ever had in my life, but he also taught me so many good lessons.

Chris Grimes:

What a wonderful way to describe him. He's been your toughest boss. I love that. Do you want to tell us a bit more about that? I think that's just such a lovely way to describe him. He's been your toughest boss. I love that. Yeah, do you want to tell us a bit more about that? I think that's just such a lovely way to describe it.

Carolina Klint:

No, but I think I mean kids know exactly right. They know exactly what to do to trigger you, how to wind you up. They know all of that because they've been with you from day one. So but with that said, I think it's. It's really incredible how parenthood can turn you and really shape your view on the world, and really I mean, for example, when I am with him. One of the lessons that I learned is that it is a complete waste of time to spend time with him and feel bad about the things I'm not doing at work. Right and reversely, when I'm at work. It is completely useless to be at work and spend time worrying about or being stressed out about, the time spent being present, being aware, and that has been such an enabler to a better life for me.

Carolina Klint:

And I think he really helped me see that and helped me learn that lesson.

Chris Grimes:

So the powerful lesson of presence, about when your presence is required to be truly in that moment, be that in a parental context or a leadership context.

Carolina Klint:

For sure. And the second lesson that he really taught me well was that anything that happens at work, if you have a scale from one to 10 in terms of stress level, really should never be able to pull you over five. Because it is work, it is okay I mean, I'm in insurance, it's not like people's lives are at stake. It's okay. You know we can have a bad day and it's okay. You can turn the page and move on, while when it comes to family matters, of course, then that is where things can go completely out of whack and you stress out because that is what really matters. So I think in a way, it's actually helped me deal with stress at work in a much more sane way.

Chris Grimes:

And giving you perspective For sure. Lovely answer. So that's the four shapages we've done. So now we're talking about three things that inspire you now, and you're taking it exactly where I want you to take it. This is wonderful. You can go where you like, when you like, how you like. We can keep rhyming or chiming on leadership if and when you ever want to. But here we go Three things now that inspire you, Carolina.

Carolina Klint:

So the first thing that really inspired me is the benefit that I've had to work across a multitude of cultures, and what really inspires me is the richness of diversity and different perspectives. It is really incredible when you bring a team together and different perspectives. It is really incredible when you bring a team together representing different perspectives, different cultures. All of that and to see how that can create dynamic discussions, value creating discussions and to me that is just beautiful. I find that really, really inspirational.

Chris Grimes:

And you describe them very beautifully as how to lead high capacity teams. So what's implicit there is the capacity to embrace diversity within what becomes the high capacity or high performance of that team. Yes, lovely answer. Second thing that inspires you.

Carolina Klint:

The second thing that really inspired me is people that are really good at what they do, and it doesn't matter what it is. It can be anything. I mean, if you're a very talented carpenter, or if you're a brilliant lawyer, a fierce litigator, maybe, or a fantastic CEO, it doesn't really matter what it is. It can be something practical, it can be something intellectual, but spending time with someone who's really really good at what they do is always so rewarding and inspiring.

Chris Grimes:

Lovely answer too, and I can't resist. But going back to the fierce litigator thing, what was it that made you decide it has to be a fierce one rather than just a litigator?

Carolina Klint:

No, I have no idea, it was just how I visualized it. You know you do something. You want to be fierce, right you?

Chris Grimes:

do, why not? It's overriding fierce with just strident confidence, which is lovely. A third shape-itch.

Carolina Klint:

So I think the third thing that really inspired me is good music. I cannot go anywhere without music because I think it can really change the ambience, it can change the mood completely. So I really surround myself with music anytime I can, anytime it's appropriate, and I think it really inspires me a lot.

Chris Grimes:

And what's your current? What's the last piece of music you listened to?

Carolina Klint:

So the last piece of music was a playlist with different. It's jazz. Um, that I listened to this morning so it set the tone for the day. You know, I have a sip of old gray tea and I listen to my jazz playlist and I get in the mood, get ready for the day.

Chris Grimes:

Metaphor there about leadership being like jazz, because you've got to be super adaptive, super flexible, a willingness to improvise perfect.

Carolina Klint:

I love it. I couldn't agree more Absolutely. And then you know you come back in the afternoon or evening and you've had a stressful day and lots of decisions to be made, and then maybe you put on a little bit of a lounge, more that kind of atmosphere, lounge music to relax a bit and chill out. So really, depending on you, know know what kind of inspiration I feel that I need, I will then vary the music lovely and now we're on to the um.

Chris Grimes:

This is borrowed from the film up where the dog goes. Oh squirrels, you know? What are the two monsters of distraction? What never fail? What are your squirrels, carolina, that never fail to distract you, irrespective of anything else that's going on?

Carolina Klint:

so my biggest, biggest hairiest squirrel is my son, because if he needs something, I will drop everything. I mean, it's the biggest squirrel that you can wave in front of me. I will be like yes, on my way, what do you need?

Chris Grimes:

Yes, and you said he's your biggest hairiest squirrel. How?

Carolina Klint:

tall is he? Because my son's two inches taller than me and I'm getting patted on the head quite a lot now. No, yes, he's about this much taller than I am now, and that's in itself. I mean, the fact that I'm the mother of a 16 year old was a bit of an identity crisis for me. I don't know, like, how did that happen? And then, when he, sort of, you know, was tiny one week and then all of a sudden he was um, much taller than I am. It's uh, it's painful, but there you go.

Chris Grimes:

Is he taller than his father yet?

Chris Grimes:

uh, no, not yet but that's coming yeah, it's coming, for sure my son's 17, and in the last month suddenly this man mountain appeared and I've not got too much up there anyway, but I'm getting patted on the head yes, exactly no, so my son's called Stan, just by the way, because I always wanted a son called Stan, because my comic hero is Stan Laurel. Oh, that's great, hardy, if you know who I mean yes, well, that's wonderful you're now allowed a second big, hairy squirrel. So what's your second squirrel or monster?

Carolina Klint:

I think the second thing that really never fails to distract me is people laughing. Like that will always grab my attention. So even if I'm really focused on something, if I hear people laughing I'm going to be like what, something I need to check out here what's happening.

Chris Grimes:

And sometimes that why are they having a better time than me? No, exactly.

Carolina Klint:

Why am I not in on this Like what's the?

Chris Grimes:

joke. Okay, now these are great squirrels. Thank you so much, but there's only two of those I know. Squirrels are ever present, but now can we have a quirky or unusual fact about you?

Carolina Klint:

we couldn't possibly know about you until you tell us, carolina so, um well, I could could pick a lot of different things, but I think that the thing that surprises people and I'm not really sure why is that I've spent 15 years in ballet school, so lots of dedication, hard work, tears and sweat.

Chris Grimes:

Wow, 15 years in ballet school.

Carolina Klint:

In ballet school.

Chris Grimes:

yes, so that was your other profession. You were nearly were you a professional ballerina then.

Carolina Klint:

Yeah well, you know I nurtured a dream of becoming a prima ballerina, but you know I switched for a fierce litigator and then I turned out in insurance, I don't know. It's an interesting trajectory.

Chris Grimes:

In how you're coming across. You're more of a sort of Darcy Bustle but a fierce litigating lawyer. So I think you've probably made the right choice, but I think it's interesting how the discipline of ballet would obviously help with the job that you now do too.

Carolina Klint:

actually, For sure. I think it actually helped to prepare me for a corporate life, ironically enough, yeah.

Chris Grimes:

We have shaken your tree majestically, hurrah. Now we stay in the clearing, move away from the tree, and next we're going to talk about alchemy and gold, carolina. So this is about purpose. When you're at purpose, in flow, what are you absolutely happiest doing in what you're here to reveal to the world?

Carolina Klint:

Nothing makes me happier than helping people I work with identify and remove whether it's real or perceived barriers to success. So helping, nudging people in the right direction. I mean I really want my legacy to be an army of people that went somewhere and where I played a tiny little part in their opportunities or in their path to success. That is really what I'm so passionate about.

Chris Grimes:

And I completely agree with. I've heard again and again that the best coaching is about nudging just nudging people into greater self-awareness, so I love the fact that you want to be remembered for being the one that helped nudge into greater achievement.

Carolina Klint:

I think it's such an important role to play and I think sometimes it's just a tiny little thing that is needed. Sometimes it's a big kick. That's okay too.

Chris Grimes:

And just a final thing, to make sure that we mention this about leadership. What would you say and this is an unexpected question, as I'm expecting this one, but what would you say was the biggest leadership lesson you'd like to share in what you've learned about yourself with the gift of hindsight as a leader?

Carolina Klint:

Oh, I have learned so many lessons, but I think one of the lessons that I've learned is that if you recognize that you definitely don't have to be the smartest person in the room, it's much better to attract and surround yourself with rock stars, because that is really what good leadership is about the ability to attract and motivate and retain real talent. That is leadership to me, because at the end of the day, it's like part of this huge leadership paradox. It's all about you as a leader, but it's not about you at all. It's all about the people, right? So you have to be the catalyst and you have to serve as the trigger for activity, or for you, or for direction or moving things along, but then you just have to let go as well. You have to delegate and you have to empower people to do their best and watch them thrive.

Chris Grimes:

And now I'm going to award you with a cake, carolina. So, first of all, do you like cake? First of all, oh, yes.

Carolina Klint:

I love cake, give me cake.

Chris Grimes:

So what cake would you like? Then? You're gonna get to put a cherry on the cake in a minute so what cake would I like?

Carolina Klint:

so I have two, and I'm not even sure if this translates well, but there is a beautiful whipped cream cake in Sweden called a princess cake, with a layer of thin green marzipan and a big rose on top. It's like a traditional Swedish one. But then I also really love something called a Budapest cake. I think these are Swedish cakes. I'm not really sure it's going to.

Chris Grimes:

I love that. The fact you want two.

Carolina Klint:

Oh for sure, no, no, no.

Chris Grimes:

I am serious about cake, so I pick two they are yours, and in fact I've got to get to the point where I actually send people the cake that they want, and so it'd be great fun to enjoy. What are your two cakes?

Chris Grimes:

again, it was a green princess cake it's a it's a princess cake yes and the second one is a budapest cake lovely, and now you get to put a cherry on both those cakes with Stuff, like Now. What's your favourite inspirational quote? First of all, that's always given you sucker and pulled you towards your future.

Carolina Klint:

So I will take a quote from Mike Tyson and I quote him a lot because I love this quote and the quote is everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face. I love that quote.

Chris Grimes:

Me too. I love that and I love the fact you said you quote him a lot because he's not renowned for being the wisest person on the planet, but he is, because that's amazing.

Carolina Klint:

Yes, I think it is such a fundamental reminder of how important it is to remain agile and flexible, and absolutely, it is good to have a plan, but it's also good to know that whatever you prepare for is probably not what's going to happen. There's probably something else waiting around the corner, and then it's good to build broader resilience. So it really ties into, of course, what I talk about on a daily basis around macro risk and risk themes.

Chris Grimes:

Lovely. So just say that quote once again. It's delicious.

Carolina Klint:

Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face Lovely.

Chris Grimes:

What's the best piece of advice you've ever been given, Carolina?

Carolina Klint:

So I think I've been given so many good pieces of advice, but one that I will never, ever forget and that I have practiced ever since it was given to me is when a mentor and friend and we were talking about work-life balance, which I really I disagree with the concept of work-life balance, because there is no balance. It is a beautiful mess and you try and make sense of it all. Right, that is what it is so. And we talked about, you know, trying to combine family and work and having ambitions and still wanting to be, you know, present at home and with friends. The list kept getting longer.

Carolina Klint:

And then she said one thing that I will never forget. She said whatever you do, you do not bring garbage home. So what that translates into is that if, even if I've had the worst day, the worst day, I will always check myself before I open the door to the house, and that means that I okay, the day is over, whatever happened at work stays at work, and I put on a smile, whether I mean it or not, and I walk into my family space, and then you know, it's like a new chapter. I turn a page and I give them a new chapter, because they do not deserve the garbage.

Chris Grimes:

I love the fact that it's a very tangible airlock between then and now as you cross the threshold of home, and I love that. Never bring garbage home. Great, with the gift of hindsight now, what notes, help or advice might you proffer to a younger version of yourself?

Carolina Klint:

So I think it is important to remember that you're going to work so many years. Your career is long, you can do everything, but you can't do it at the same time, but that's OK. So being a little bit patient and letting that river that becomes your carrier take its time and make it stops and take some turns I mean, a career is not like a linear experience. It's like a freaking jungle gym. It's all over the place and you jump lateral and you jump up and then you're bumped down and then you go up and that only helps you prepare for whatever comes next. And I think having a little bit of confidence and patience with that knowledge, I think is one of the most important things that I would pass on.

Chris Grimes:

And I know you're borrowing from your mother's wonderful philosophy of it's not over until it's not over, and it's not over. What's next, what's next, what's next, what's next. And I love that your career is a jungle gym.

Carolina Klint:

It is all over the place and it's supposed to be all over the place, and sometimes it can be really beneficial again to make a lateral move, because it will give you different perspectives. I mean, when I moved from being a CEO into a regional role, for example, when I was asked the question whether or not that was something I would consider, I really thought of it as a trap initially. I was like, hmm, I'm not sure. Actually, for a woman to give up the CEO title and to walk away from a P&L responsibility, I think it's a trap, but you know what Very suspicious. But you know what. It turned out to be the best thing I've ever done and it was a role that actually worked much better for me. It suited my personality and the things that I'm passionate about so much better, so it was perfect. I'm really happy about that.

Chris Grimes:

And how wonderful that you're able to trust the source that was giving you that nudge to take you into the new opportunity as well, I laugh.

Carolina Klint:

because I didn't trust the source initially. So I got asked the question once. I got asked the question twice and the third time my boss called me and said Carolina, it's not a question anymore. And I said oh yes sir. Okay, of course, nope, here we go.

Chris Grimes:

There is that lovely quote as well, which is what's meant for you won't pass you by. So provided we can be present to that. Sometimes, you know, windows of opportunity can suddenly have a much more lubricated hinge than we truly appreciate. Yeah, I agree, that's right. Okay, so now we're ramping up to shakespeare shortly to talk about legacy, which you've mentioned already in a, in a small version, but we're going to go to a more overt version. But just before we get there, this is the pass the golden baton moment, please. Yes, now you've experienced this from within. Who would you most like to pass the golden baton along to? To keep the golden thread of storytelling going?

Carolina Klint:

Yes. So when I worked in the United States, based in Atlanta, georgia I had a fantastic CFO. Her name is Maria Angelova and she made a very bold decision to leave corporate life to start a journey of entrepreneurship and she founded her company, rebellious International, where she is focusing on helping people reach their full potential really body-soul alignment and I think it is so brave and I'm so proud of her, even though I was super disappointed when she resigned. I have to say, looking back was probably the best thing she could have done and I think she has a fantastic story to tell and she's also super inspirational.

Chris Grimes:

And lovely. Just spell her second name for me.

Carolina Klint:

Angelova. Angelova A-N-G-E-L-O-V-A.

Chris Grimes:

So Martha.

Carolina Klint:

Maria Maria Maria Angela.

Chris Grimes:

Just as well, I checked. Thank you very much yes. Love that and rebellious international Boom, Thank you. That sounds like a complete privilege. And now, inspired by Shakespeare and all the world's esteemed and all the bed women, millie players. This is borrowing from the seven ages of man's speech. Now to talk about legacy, Carolina and how. When all is said and done, and there's a lovely sound effect coming now, how would you most like to be remembered?

Carolina Klint:

Oh, wow, can I go big, go big. No, you know what it's really about enabling seeing people thrive. That is really what I'm so passionate about and what I want my legacy to be. But let's put that in a bigger context. Then why don't we say if people think about me after I'm gone and they say she made the world a better place, I think you know, in the small things doesn't have to be big, but just contributing to the world and making it a better place.

Carolina Klint:

I think you know, in the small things it doesn't have to be big, but just contributing to the world and making it a better place. That would be fantastic.

Chris Grimes:

Lovely and I'll just let a bit of float there. And can I just say what a complete breath of fresh air you are in the point of view of if you can imagine a program about to start where you're going to talk to somebody who works within insurance and within risk and enter Carolina Clint and what a breath of fresh air. And it's no surprise at all that you're on the open road of trailblazing as an ambassador for Marsh McLennan and where are you next appearing to give a next talk?

Carolina Klint:

Oh, my next talk is let me see, well, I'm in Paris later this week, and then next week I'm in New York and the week after I'm in London, and it never stops. It never stops, chris, and it's all good.

Chris Grimes:

Wow, on the open road. That's fantastic. Where can we find out all about you and Marsh McLennan on the internet? All about you and Marsh McLennan on the internet.

Carolina Klint:

So, marsh McLennan, of course it's easy to Google. You will find lots of materials and information. If you're interested in risk, I think the Global Risks Report is a really good place. You will find numerous videos and podcasts and things where I have tried to translate the themes of the Global Risk Report into something more tangible. And then, of course, I'm on LinkedIn.

Chris Grimes:

Wonderful Hurrah. So, as this has been your moment in the sunshine, in the good, listening to show stories of distinction and genius, particularly leadership reflections, is there anything else you'd like to say, carolina?

Carolina Klint:

Just a big thank you for the opportunity, and I walk away from this experience feeling refreshed and like the sun is shining on me. So thank you, chris.

Chris Grimes:

Wonderful, just like your dad's philosophy. He wakes up every day. The sun is shining. So, ladies and gentlemen, also thank you so much for watching this on LinkedIn. If you'd like to talk about guesting, too, have a look at the goodlistening2showcom website. There are a number of different series strands as to how exactly you can get involved, but this has been the wonderful Carolina Clint from Marsh McLennan, and your full title is your COO of. Just just tell us the sort of rather swanky job title.

Carolina Klint:

CCO, chief Commercial Officer for Marsh McLennan, europe, wonderful.

Chris Grimes:

Yes. So thank you so much for being here and thank you for watching on LinkedIn too. Thank you very much indeed, and I'll stop recording there. Good night. You've been listening to the Good Listening To Show here on UK Health Radio with me, chris Grimes oh, it's my son. If you've enjoyed the show, then please do tune in next week to listen to more stories from the Clearing. If you'd like to connect with me on LinkedIn, then please do so. There's also a dedicated facebook group for the show too. You can contact me about the program or, if you'd be interested in experiencing some personal impact coaching with me. Care of my level up your impact program. That's chris at second curve dot uk on twitter and instagram. It's at that, chris grimes. So until next time for me, chris grimes from uk health rodeo and from stan to your good health. And goodbye, carolina Clint, you've just been given a good listening to show experience. Could I just get your immediate feedback on what that was like for you being in this structure?

Carolina Klint:

It was delightful. I enjoyed every minute of it. It is a great structure. It gives prompts and it really made me think as well. I learned things about myself, so thank you.

Chris Grimes:

You're very welcome.